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[Music]

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thank you

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[Music]

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hey guys how's it going welcome back

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what's up

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Katie it's good to see you it's good to

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be here it's been about a month it has

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yeah yeah happy to be back in this this

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hot seat here absolutely well it's good

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to see people in the live chat already

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as always guys just keep the chat nice

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and cool and calm and collected

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and everything will go smoothly so Katie

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Let's uh do you want to introduce Our

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Guest I do well only so smoothly because

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today everybody we are bringing forth

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one of the ogs of ufology Mr

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doctor actually Alan Greenfield he was

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the ufologist of the year in 1972 and

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1992. he's written about a billion books

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about the occult and he's apparently a

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rescuer of Lost ufologists

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Alan thanks so much for being with us

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oh I'm always delighted to be on

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something live so if I really say

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something outrageous you can't take it

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okay I'll drink a little tea I'll be

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fine

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yeah we'll see about that

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[Laughter]

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so for people who are not familiar with

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your work tell us a little bit about how

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you got into ufology to begin with

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you've been in it for quite some time

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and we'd love to hear about what got you

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into the field

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decades and decades and decades

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I was fortunate enough to get in when

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all of the first gen ufologists as I

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said in one of my books

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which one was it us all sorts and

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saucers plug number one number one

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number one

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uh not a book that I'm particularly

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sometimes I'm use even me

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but uh uh the way I got in was just at a

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time in my

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uh teen years when I was interested in

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lots of stuff and got involved with lots

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of Clubby things call it a uh adolescent

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uh

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fetish of sorts because that's what it

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was I mean the timing of Freudian would

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have a field day with I joined the

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Mystic Arts Book Society the science

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fiction book club and

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and joined the worst possible UFO group

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that I can join which is that that was

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nightcap the national investigation

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committee on aerial phenomena at 1536

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Connecticut Avenue Washington 6 DC for

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old folks like me they'll know that

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before there were zip codes

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there were zones

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yeah like I'm still living I live in the

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same Zone after having traveled all over

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the world I'm living in the same Zone

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that I grew up in so you know it's uh

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listen Alan you you sort of best known I

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think for your your book The Secret

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Cipher of the youthful notes so I just

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wondered what inspired you to write the

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book and if you could also give us kind

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of a brief outline for anyone that's not

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familiar with it of what it's about

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I certainly hope so because I I've got

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about four hours in me and then being a

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mature

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probably will tie her off to bed for the

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rest of the day but that's you know so

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it is and so it is notice I am wearing a

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Hawaiian shirt

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which I seem to always wear and because

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I'm in a temp apartment because they're

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renovating my quarters

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you know putting the padding in and the

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jacket you know all those things

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syringes uh

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I uh

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don't know where much of anything is but

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anyway to your question

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um

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I got involved because I was interested

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all of my life and I mean literally

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going back as far as I can remember and

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I remember back to two

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fascinated with UFOs

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I'm unfascinated with uaps you apps as I

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like to call them you have you have yeah

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uh

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we're dancing to the government to

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I want to discourage you folks right

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here at the top before you cut me off

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don't use it friends it's playing to

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their

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Eternal game of build them up

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and then disillusion them I've been

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through that

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five times now in the long history of

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ufology that I'm in but anyway I I got

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in just early enough

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through the teen ufology movement as it

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was then down some of us are still

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active like

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Gene Steinberg

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I'm sorry he's a friend of mine sorry

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he's a long long time acquaintance

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uh and uh Rick hilberg and Dave Halpern

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who actually has something on the ball

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and if y'all haven't had him on you all

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ought to have him on Chris

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Dave's a real scholar with good

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credentials better than mine actually

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because they're in the right field

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whereas mine is in

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left field far out in the left field

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we like the left field it's interesting

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well that's a that's because I'm a

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leftist but that's neither here

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I'm an old one left or something

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so one of the things that I have been

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fascinated by with your work Alan is the

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marrying of ufology in the occult

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community and I think for folks who

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haven't watched Hellier plug Hillier or

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haven't read secret Cipher reviews not

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for your other work could you go a

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little bit into you know the Western

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mystery tradition in esoteric schools

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and what the cipher comes from

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okay

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um I I came to the cipher through a side

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door so to speak I had been since

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way way back with the Dinosaurs rules

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the earth I had been both involved in a

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ceremonial magic with a K on the end as

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Crowley's affectation has and then I

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prefer because it isn't stage frista

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digitation

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did I say that right press the

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digitization you know you press the

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button and the duck comes down and gives

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you a hundred dollars you know that

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scratch of marks and you I'm sorry

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we get confused out here on the Dead Sea

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you can't swim in it but you can walk on

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yeah

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you can walk on the Dead Sea because

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it's like

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90 salt and ten percent water I know

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yeah I put that in it in Reddit book

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while swimming in it it's weird you

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can't drown there even if you want to

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even if you're weighed down by Stones

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which there aren't a lot of in that area

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um

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oh that was something all my life I read

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a book in the early 1960s this isn't

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going to deal with your question at all

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but

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go for it

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it was called it was by a reform Rabbi

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which happens to be the religion that I

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follow uh and have been you know I'm a

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lifelong follower of it while everybody

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else I know is into some kind of crazy

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Richie Richie thing not to say anybody

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here uh and you know I am very cool with

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those circles because I like weird stuff

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uh it's a

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pretty oatmeal type

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religious preference but on the other

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hand it's very inclusive and it's uh

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got liberal attitudes towards the

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Supernatural and I could go on about

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that what did I get to that for

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plugging the temple on Peachtree where I

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attend services on a rare occasions

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[Laughter]

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well is the temple on Peach Tree where

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the cipher comes from come on no no no

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no no no no no no you're good at

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circling back I am I'm gonna I'm gonna

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wrap a little rope around you and reel

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you back to the question

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because I know because I think that your

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work is criminally

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Miss missed in in the modern ufology

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movement and I think it's it's widely

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known in the Paranormal Community

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um in the occult community and I think

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there are a lot of folks here as much as

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you don't like us disclosure folks I

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know it's okay that are very interested

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in Keel ideas valet idea is what not and

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are right on the cusp of learning about

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some of the things you talk about and I

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think that you're a great door into that

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so um I'm probably the only door of my

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generation because back in the day

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people would read Keel and still try to

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interpret it in terms of Ye Olde

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extraterrestrial quote hypothesis

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unquote isn't a hypothesis it's a belief

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system like a lot of things that call

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well I'll tell you the story of how I

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got involved okay

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I was already many many years in ufology

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and at the time

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uh which is Circa

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1980s early 90s somewhere in there

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through the complicated world of my uh

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how should I put it

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my complex love life

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I'll get back to that let me drink a

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little tea here

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which is in one of my books called what

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is it called

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we know we know your Sex Magic Book

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is that what it is

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I thought it was a sort of a parody of

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uh you know uh going down the rabbit

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hole Alice

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in Wonderland did you know that dude

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that wrote that was

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when he was not writing books for

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children he was taking nude pictures of

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little girls

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the Reverend Dodd I think was his real

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name Lewis Carroll yeah that was well is

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it the 1800s it was not quite the same

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but uh

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still

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perv but uh but who am I

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don't call anybody

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so so where was I going with all this

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Meandering along is entering into the

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Kabbalah Cipher how you came across that

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okay I the only reason it overlaps with

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my

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storied of Life some of which is in the

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book I mean I that took some strain and

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guts on my part to impart because

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it's

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all the books that deal with sexual

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magic other than mine deal with it from

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a theoretical standpoint only and I you

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know I go into that but it's basically

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the secrets that haven't been secret for

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a very long time

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um and then the second half of the book

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is basically about my own experiences

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with it and that's nobody else is doing

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that with the impossible exception

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briefly of a guy named Lewis culling who

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unfortunately has forgotten to history

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but he influenced me a lot

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anyway so

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my

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second wife's second husband

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who

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nevertheless is mostly known by the name

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Tina because

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she was trans for half the time that I

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knew her but back when she was still

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doing the guy thing as I say

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um

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she was one of the chief cooks and

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bottle washers and eventually became the

280
00:14:24,650 --> 00:14:21,019
outer head of the order qblh which for

281
00:14:28,009 --> 00:14:24,660
reasons that are not self-apparent

282
00:14:29,629 --> 00:14:28,019
unlike many organizations did not see

283
00:14:32,629 --> 00:14:29,639
itself

284
00:14:37,129 --> 00:14:32,639
at least on the local level as a rival

285
00:14:43,750 --> 00:14:39,590
oh excuse me I'll give the Scout a you

286
00:14:48,170 --> 00:14:43,760
know Scout salute 93.

287
00:14:51,949 --> 00:14:48,180
love and will okay love will and [\h__\h]

288
00:14:59,569 --> 00:14:56,030
title of DNS with a pine cone however

289
00:15:04,250 --> 00:14:59,579
just just a couple of days ago my my

290
00:15:05,389 --> 00:15:04,260
dear friends the uh uh the newkirks were

291
00:15:08,150 --> 00:15:05,399
saying

292
00:15:11,389 --> 00:15:08,160
can you guess what a call to order Alan

293
00:15:13,189 --> 00:15:11,399
Greenfield is and they said oh he was in

294
00:15:17,150 --> 00:15:13,199
the Oto because he uses every

295
00:15:22,090 --> 00:15:17,160
opportunity on the air to trash them

296
00:15:30,110 --> 00:15:26,689
and I I'm glad to fulfill that role but

297
00:15:33,230 --> 00:15:30,120
anyway uh my second wife's

298
00:15:35,269 --> 00:15:33,240
second husband was a guy that I felt

299
00:15:37,610 --> 00:15:35,279
kind of ambiguous about things they had

300
00:15:39,350 --> 00:15:37,620
children together and then they went

301
00:15:44,329 --> 00:15:39,360
through a big scene because she didn't

302
00:15:47,050 --> 00:15:44,339
like he was in transition I remember a

303
00:15:50,150 --> 00:15:47,060
famous phone call

304
00:15:52,970 --> 00:15:50,160
that I I mean we were on friendly we're

305
00:15:54,949 --> 00:15:52,980
still on friendly terms as far as I know

306
00:15:56,150 --> 00:15:54,959
she isn't going to shoot me and I'm not

307
00:15:58,790 --> 00:15:56,160
going to shoot her and that's better

308
00:16:02,090 --> 00:15:58,800
than I can say with her successor

309
00:16:05,269 --> 00:16:02,100
but anyway uh

310
00:16:08,889 --> 00:16:05,279
uh this story gets a really complicated

311
00:16:12,250 --> 00:16:08,899
so hold on to your uh

312
00:16:15,290 --> 00:16:12,260
but um

313
00:16:16,970 --> 00:16:15,300
my third wife whose name I never

314
00:16:18,889 --> 00:16:16,980
mentioned because she was among other

315
00:16:21,949 --> 00:16:18,899
things a junkie and

316
00:16:24,290 --> 00:16:21,959
a thief and a hooker and there's nothing

317
00:16:27,230 --> 00:16:24,300
wrong with being a hooker but being a

318
00:16:31,910 --> 00:16:27,240
junkie there's something real real wrong

319
00:16:33,650 --> 00:16:31,920
with that I I know and when I the way I

320
00:16:36,110 --> 00:16:33,660
found out she was a thief was she was

321
00:16:39,050 --> 00:16:36,120
taking our children with her when she

322
00:16:40,730 --> 00:16:39,060
was out robbing department stores and

323
00:16:43,490 --> 00:16:40,740
got caught and I got a call from

324
00:16:45,590 --> 00:16:43,500
security saying uh this woman is being

325
00:16:48,829 --> 00:16:45,600
arrested and you should come and collect

326
00:16:52,490 --> 00:16:48,839
your two kids to which I said somewhat

327
00:16:56,329 --> 00:16:52,500
elegantly say what

328
00:17:01,850 --> 00:16:56,339
I'm out of town but I did go collecting

329
00:17:03,889 --> 00:17:01,860
and then it was a mess but anyway she um

330
00:17:08,329 --> 00:17:03,899
uh

331
00:17:11,689 --> 00:17:08,339
I was working like a 50 60 hour week and

332
00:17:15,289 --> 00:17:11,699
she was apparently indulging her

333
00:17:20,569 --> 00:17:15,299
then girlfriend and uh

334
00:17:23,270 --> 00:17:20,579
uh and stealing like a mofo like zots

335
00:17:26,449 --> 00:17:23,280
and lots because she once proudly showed

336
00:17:29,570 --> 00:17:26,459
me this list of stores that they had

337
00:17:32,810 --> 00:17:29,580
and items that they had taken the funny

338
00:17:35,210 --> 00:17:32,820
thing is none of that money ever came

339
00:17:39,230 --> 00:17:35,220
into my household so I assume it was

340
00:17:42,169 --> 00:17:39,240
went to drugs or went to the ring or

341
00:17:45,470 --> 00:17:42,179
whatever so I called my ex-wife number

342
00:17:48,350 --> 00:17:45,480
two and I said

343
00:17:51,230 --> 00:17:48,360
my wife told me she's a lesbian and she

344
00:17:54,110 --> 00:17:51,240
will have sex with me anymore

345
00:17:58,970 --> 00:17:54,120
and she said you think you've got

346
00:18:01,310 --> 00:17:58,980
problems my husband is a woman

347
00:18:02,810 --> 00:18:01,320
I said okay you're always [\h__\h]

348
00:18:06,490 --> 00:18:02,820
topping me

349
00:18:11,750 --> 00:18:06,500
I give up okay

350
00:18:14,510 --> 00:18:11,760
but the truth is that by the time they

351
00:18:18,950 --> 00:18:14,520
got involved I just said I like him

352
00:18:20,029 --> 00:18:18,960
than him better than I liked her so

353
00:18:22,549 --> 00:18:20,039
um

354
00:18:25,070 --> 00:18:22,559
uh we developed a relationship I got

355
00:18:27,010 --> 00:18:25,080
involved with qblh even though I was

356
00:18:30,950 --> 00:18:27,020
then a

357
00:18:32,930 --> 00:18:30,960
one of the fair-haired boys of the Oto

358
00:18:34,430 --> 00:18:32,940
if you can believe that actually

359
00:18:37,909 --> 00:18:34,440
happened

360
00:18:39,710 --> 00:18:37,919
it did so you know I think I was that

361
00:18:42,310 --> 00:18:39,720
was during the period I was the lodge

362
00:18:45,470 --> 00:18:42,320
master of Euless Lodge Number 10

363
00:18:49,730 --> 00:18:45,480
Incorporated but I won't talk about the

364
00:18:51,850 --> 00:18:49,740
Oto because I always do and I don't like

365
00:18:54,830 --> 00:18:51,860
becoming a cliche

366
00:18:56,169 --> 00:18:54,840
purple verbal but uh

367
00:19:01,010 --> 00:18:56,179
so

368
00:19:04,210 --> 00:19:01,020
qblh brought the

369
00:19:08,510 --> 00:19:04,220
the cipher based on liberal legus

370
00:19:11,390 --> 00:19:08,520
Crowley's magnum opus if you believe me

371
00:19:13,310 --> 00:19:11,400
or if you believe him the book that was

372
00:19:17,210 --> 00:19:13,320
dictated to him by the Prater human

373
00:19:21,169 --> 00:19:17,220
intelligence I was there already is your

374
00:19:24,110 --> 00:19:21,179
link to ufology and to trans channeling

375
00:19:26,690 --> 00:19:24,120
which is of the ufology sort which

376
00:19:29,870 --> 00:19:26,700
claims to be from

377
00:19:34,070 --> 00:19:29,880
let's say non-terrestrial sources

378
00:19:37,070 --> 00:19:34,080
Crowley was astute enough even in 1904

379
00:19:38,870 --> 00:19:37,080
the Year this historically important

380
00:19:41,710 --> 00:19:38,880
thing happened I mean of course the

381
00:19:45,470 --> 00:19:41,720
birth of my father not the dictation of

382
00:19:47,870 --> 00:19:45,480
liberal legus actually

383
00:19:50,510 --> 00:19:47,880
he was born on the first day of the

384
00:19:52,789 --> 00:19:50,520
Cairo working which was the

385
00:19:55,370 --> 00:19:52,799
Islamic

386
00:19:57,169 --> 00:19:55,380
version of

387
00:20:01,510 --> 00:19:57,179
you know the

388
00:20:08,630 --> 00:20:05,630
15 oops today

389
00:20:12,190 --> 00:20:08,640
Ten Commandments for the people Mel

390
00:20:20,450 --> 00:20:17,090
1981. now earlier 71

391
00:20:23,210 --> 00:20:20,460
couldn't tell you okay so Crowley's here

392
00:20:24,350 --> 00:20:23,220
in Cairo right and he basically channels

393
00:20:31,150 --> 00:20:24,360
this

394
00:20:36,529 --> 00:20:31,160
it contains a cipher correct

395
00:20:38,750 --> 00:20:36,539
well yes but he could not if in fact the

396
00:20:40,190 --> 00:20:38,760
text itself says that he would never

397
00:20:43,909 --> 00:20:40,200
decipher it

398
00:20:46,850 --> 00:20:43,919
he tried in fact the way they were able

399
00:20:50,270 --> 00:20:46,860
to work on it it was not an American

400
00:20:52,430 --> 00:20:50,280
group qblh or otherwise that deciphered

401
00:20:56,930 --> 00:20:52,440
this it was um

402
00:21:00,490 --> 00:20:56,940
uh Jim Lee's Carol Smith and the

403
00:21:03,350 --> 00:21:00,500
recently deceased Jake Street and Kent

404
00:21:05,890 --> 00:21:03,360
who were centered around the British

405
00:21:08,270 --> 00:21:05,900
Journal of ceremonial magic

406
00:21:12,490 --> 00:21:08,280
and were

407
00:21:17,270 --> 00:21:15,770
occult group that had a better take on

408
00:21:20,029 --> 00:21:17,280
things than most of the occult

409
00:21:22,490 --> 00:21:20,039
organizations that have the vast

410
00:21:24,710 --> 00:21:22,500
majority of their membership over here

411
00:21:26,630 --> 00:21:24,720
on this side of the pond

412
00:21:42,230 --> 00:21:26,640
and uh

413
00:21:45,770 --> 00:21:42,240
decoding of this Cipher that existed in

414
00:21:50,029 --> 00:21:45,780
Libra all that made coherent sense all

415
00:21:53,029 --> 00:21:50,039
the way through and was seen as a way to

416
00:21:56,510 --> 00:21:53,039
clarify occult stuff

417
00:21:58,510 --> 00:21:56,520
of course the magical groups the major

418
00:22:01,730 --> 00:21:58,520
groups in America

419
00:22:04,190 --> 00:22:01,740
decided that that was [\h__\h] because

420
00:22:06,789 --> 00:22:04,200
it wasn't coming from them

421
00:22:10,669 --> 00:22:06,799
and that it's just it's always getting

422
00:22:13,370 --> 00:22:10,679
politics politics politics

423
00:22:15,590 --> 00:22:13,380
but you took the cipher a step further

424
00:22:19,310 --> 00:22:15,600
because you noticed that a lot of these

425
00:22:22,310 --> 00:22:19,320
historical UFO cases they were weird

426
00:22:25,549 --> 00:22:22,320
names content names things like that

427
00:22:27,529 --> 00:22:25,559
right you're moving the story along at a

428
00:22:32,510 --> 00:22:27,539
pace that I can't keep up with because

429
00:22:36,470 --> 00:22:32,520
I'm old I'm sorry slow it down then so

430
00:22:39,950 --> 00:22:36,480
Kim or Tina as I think for now but at

431
00:22:43,250 --> 00:22:39,960
that time Tim says hey Alan

432
00:22:45,770 --> 00:22:43,260
are you acquainted with the uh

433
00:22:47,750 --> 00:22:45,780
uh naeq

434
00:22:49,610 --> 00:22:47,760
and I said is that some kind of English

435
00:22:52,669 --> 00:22:49,620
Kabbalah because I've heard other

436
00:22:56,029 --> 00:22:52,679
English kabbalahs and at one time I was

437
00:22:58,430 --> 00:22:56,039
the greeter at Euless Lodge back at the

438
00:23:00,289 --> 00:22:58,440
beginning and half the people that came

439
00:23:02,529 --> 00:23:00,299
in said they were reincarnations of

440
00:23:08,090 --> 00:23:02,539
Aleister Crowley and the other half said

441
00:23:14,810 --> 00:23:11,810
go sit over at our meeting table next to

442
00:23:17,570 --> 00:23:14,820
the other manifestations of the God of

443
00:23:24,830 --> 00:23:17,580
Wars I mean it was the too many

444
00:23:31,610 --> 00:23:29,630
bill of Horus and Steve Horus and so it

445
00:23:34,909 --> 00:23:31,620
was a lot of that I mean you got sincere

446
00:23:37,970 --> 00:23:34,919
people but mostly you got drug addicts

447
00:23:40,970 --> 00:23:37,980
and people looking to get laid that was

448
00:23:42,890 --> 00:23:40,980
dear agar back in the day in that

449
00:23:49,330 --> 00:23:42,900
organization whose name I've now

450
00:23:56,330 --> 00:23:53,090
oh always they they have been very very

451
00:23:59,049 --> 00:23:56,340
good to me they're good people yes they

452
00:24:03,049 --> 00:23:59,059
are and also very very

453
00:24:07,789 --> 00:24:03,059
on the beam in the zone however you want

454
00:24:12,830 --> 00:24:07,799
to put it and you know my hope is since

455
00:24:14,470 --> 00:24:12,840
my generation is very fading what a

456
00:24:15,490 --> 00:24:14,480
world

457
00:24:16,789 --> 00:24:15,500
[Laughter]

458
00:24:22,370 --> 00:24:16,799
[Music]

459
00:24:24,529 --> 00:24:22,380
that people in their oh 30s and 40s are

460
00:24:26,450 --> 00:24:24,539
going to take up the banner and for a

461
00:24:29,270 --> 00:24:26,460
long time I kept expecting it and

462
00:24:30,970 --> 00:24:29,280
getting more people who were

463
00:24:35,510 --> 00:24:30,980
you know

464
00:24:38,930 --> 00:24:35,520
uh doing what what ufologists of my

465
00:24:40,070 --> 00:24:38,940
generation were doing 50 years ago

466
00:24:42,470 --> 00:24:40,080
literally

467
00:24:45,890 --> 00:24:42,480
and reaching the same non-conclusion

468
00:24:47,990 --> 00:24:45,900
which is no conclusion at all just we

469
00:24:50,630 --> 00:24:48,000
believe they are extraterrestrial in

470
00:24:53,990 --> 00:24:50,640
their visiting the Earth and depending

471
00:24:57,010 --> 00:24:54,000
on how liberal

472
00:25:00,890 --> 00:24:57,020
everybody see this quotes

473
00:25:03,970 --> 00:25:00,900
how liberal they were they would say and

474
00:25:07,010 --> 00:25:03,980
perhaps some of these

475
00:25:11,029 --> 00:25:07,020
Landing cases

476
00:25:14,390 --> 00:25:11,039
who our boss is getting really mad at me

477
00:25:16,730 --> 00:25:14,400
now I can see it on his face I'm a

478
00:25:23,049 --> 00:25:16,740
person of loving kindness

479
00:25:31,850 --> 00:25:25,850
you are now a knight of the French

480
00:25:36,590 --> 00:25:34,430
I made my publisher a night but that's

481
00:25:39,049 --> 00:25:36,600
neither here nor there that's

482
00:25:40,669 --> 00:25:39,059
something we do we make on Bishops we

483
00:25:43,730 --> 00:25:40,679
make them nights we push them off into

484
00:25:46,490 --> 00:25:43,740
the ether and let them become whatever

485
00:25:48,789 --> 00:25:46,500
they want to become because

486
00:25:52,430 --> 00:25:48,799
the one thing I learned from that

487
00:25:53,570 --> 00:25:52,440
organization whose Name Escapes me is

488
00:25:57,950 --> 00:25:53,580
that

489
00:26:01,130 --> 00:25:57,960
people need to be who they are not who

490
00:26:04,090 --> 00:26:01,140
the group wishes them to be so give them

491
00:26:07,029 --> 00:26:04,100
the authority

492
00:26:09,370 --> 00:26:07,039
my fingers are disappearing what is it

493
00:26:12,710 --> 00:26:09,380
into the Dead Sea

494
00:26:15,409 --> 00:26:12,720
it means I don't own a green screen and

495
00:26:19,190 --> 00:26:15,419
I'm too poor to buy one

496
00:26:21,950 --> 00:26:19,200
right there with you buddy okay yeah I

497
00:26:24,590 --> 00:26:21,960
mean look when I chose to be a writer

498
00:26:27,710 --> 00:26:24,600
rather than a teacher or a rabbi or

499
00:26:30,289 --> 00:26:27,720
something with the credentials I had I

500
00:26:34,690 --> 00:26:30,299
can it was the 70s

501
00:26:37,490 --> 00:26:34,700
and all things were ideal in the 70s

502
00:26:39,350 --> 00:26:37,500
most have forgotten that era because

503
00:26:42,830 --> 00:26:39,360
they were way too stoned to remember it

504
00:26:44,930 --> 00:26:42,840
and anyway it's embarrassing I wasn't I

505
00:26:47,690 --> 00:26:44,940
wasn't stoned at all I would watch them

506
00:26:50,390 --> 00:26:47,700
take their hundred dollar bill go out to

507
00:26:52,370 --> 00:26:50,400
their cars from the Limelight at the

508
00:26:53,750 --> 00:26:52,380
Disco Kroger which is the local

509
00:26:56,990 --> 00:26:53,760
equivalent of

510
00:27:01,310 --> 00:26:57,000
was it called in New York this is I

511
00:27:03,649 --> 00:27:01,320
remember 71 64. uh Trump hung out there

512
00:27:05,870 --> 00:27:03,659
all of the beautiful people hung out

513
00:27:09,070 --> 00:27:05,880
what was the name of that club the Disco

514
00:27:13,390 --> 00:27:09,080
to end all discus way before your time

515
00:27:17,350 --> 00:27:13,400
GTA 54 yes Bingo

516
00:27:17,360 --> 00:27:21,230
it was 100

517
00:27:26,289 --> 00:27:24,890
it varies you know it was like 25 on

518
00:27:29,990 --> 00:27:26,299
some episodes

519
00:27:32,570 --> 00:27:30,000
but that was just Groucho you know yeah

520
00:27:35,990 --> 00:27:32,580
we my people have a reputation of

521
00:27:37,730 --> 00:27:36,000
stinginess which is not true and I am

522
00:27:40,669 --> 00:27:37,740
taking all the money that you're paying

523
00:27:42,950 --> 00:27:40,679
me to say whatever it is you want me to

524
00:27:47,330 --> 00:27:42,960
everything we are we are paying you

525
00:27:51,169 --> 00:27:47,340
quite handsomely yes yes the the usual

526
00:27:53,210 --> 00:27:51,179
fee that most podcasts uh pay which is

527
00:27:55,370 --> 00:27:53,220
why I like to do podcasts I used to do

528
00:27:58,130 --> 00:27:55,380
television and they do pay

529
00:28:01,490 --> 00:27:58,140
but then you have to to perform like a

530
00:28:02,870 --> 00:28:01,500
trained monkey I mean quite literally

531
00:28:06,529 --> 00:28:02,880
you know

532
00:28:08,570 --> 00:28:06,539
they said okay move to your mark and see

533
00:28:12,409 --> 00:28:08,580
our hosts

534
00:28:15,049 --> 00:28:12,419
say Mark that's something from

535
00:28:19,190 --> 00:28:15,059
acting isn't it

536
00:28:22,490 --> 00:28:19,200
I am not an acouture I have on more than

537
00:28:24,409 --> 00:28:22,500
a few occasions been a performer of

538
00:28:29,870 --> 00:28:24,419
ritual

539
00:28:31,970 --> 00:28:29,880
mystery plays but I am not an acator and

540
00:28:35,570 --> 00:28:31,980
I more importantly this was in New York

541
00:28:41,269 --> 00:28:38,330
I'm not a member of the Union

542
00:28:43,909 --> 00:28:41,279
so then after this whole thing this was

543
00:28:46,990 --> 00:28:43,919
on what was it on

544
00:28:51,310 --> 00:28:47,000
uh Brad meltzer's

545
00:28:58,669 --> 00:28:55,130
with the three the three experts no

546
00:29:01,850 --> 00:28:58,679
Larry and curling and uh

547
00:29:03,529 --> 00:29:01,860
they had me do this at the end I mean we

548
00:29:06,710 --> 00:29:03,539
had sat and talked for a couple hours

549
00:29:09,049 --> 00:29:06,720
they edited my part down to like a

550
00:29:11,269 --> 00:29:09,059
minute but well it wasn't quite a minute

551
00:29:15,350 --> 00:29:11,279
it was more like three minutes and then

552
00:29:17,269 --> 00:29:15,360
they said okay but you have to greet us

553
00:29:18,889 --> 00:29:17,279
so go back to the ferry this was on

554
00:29:20,810 --> 00:29:18,899
Liberty Island

555
00:29:25,549 --> 00:29:20,820
and act like you're getting off the

556
00:29:27,710 --> 00:29:25,559
ferry move to your mark recognize us and

557
00:29:30,950 --> 00:29:27,720
we will meet and I thought

558
00:29:34,549 --> 00:29:30,960
you fakes

559
00:29:37,070 --> 00:29:34,559
[\h__\h] frauds do I do this or do I just

560
00:29:40,210 --> 00:29:37,080
walk onto the ferry but no they haven't

561
00:29:42,470 --> 00:29:40,220
given me cab fare back in my hotel yet

562
00:29:44,330 --> 00:29:42,480
and anyway they're paying for the hotel

563
00:29:47,090 --> 00:29:44,340
bill and if I piss them off they

564
00:29:49,850 --> 00:29:47,100
probably will stick me with the bill so

565
00:29:52,730 --> 00:29:49,860
I said okay so I walk to the mark look

566
00:30:00,010 --> 00:29:57,710
you must be the experts Mo Larry and

567
00:30:03,590 --> 00:30:00,020
Curly Joe

568
00:30:07,190 --> 00:30:03,600
I'm sure they loved that they said go

569
00:30:09,710 --> 00:30:07,200
for take two back to the ferry so we

570
00:30:12,789 --> 00:30:09,720
went through it a number of times I

571
00:30:15,370 --> 00:30:12,799
stopped doing uh a hysteria Channel

572
00:30:19,610 --> 00:30:15,380
programs after that

573
00:30:22,549 --> 00:30:19,620
that's a good one I I'm I'm good at this

574
00:30:24,549 --> 00:30:22,559
sort of things the odor template oops

575
00:30:28,250 --> 00:30:24,559
I'm saying it again

576
00:30:30,730 --> 00:30:28,260
well it's the only cult I ever belong to

577
00:30:33,649 --> 00:30:30,740
unless you count the Boy Scouts

578
00:30:35,330 --> 00:30:33,659
and I you know I I had a better

579
00:30:38,090 --> 00:30:35,340
experience there

580
00:30:41,810 --> 00:30:38,100
and it was less expensive and

581
00:30:42,710 --> 00:30:41,820
had all the signs and grips and all of

582
00:30:48,110 --> 00:30:42,720
that

583
00:30:50,590 --> 00:30:48,120
help you get

584
00:30:53,990 --> 00:30:50,600
to those ultimate degrees

585
00:30:57,049 --> 00:30:54,000
where you get whispered in your ear

586
00:31:02,450 --> 00:30:57,059
read the document

587
00:31:07,669 --> 00:31:04,630
oh yeah right

588
00:31:13,250 --> 00:31:07,679
the guy that did way too much acid in

589
00:31:15,130 --> 00:31:13,260
the 60s so okay so anyway so

590
00:31:20,210 --> 00:31:15,140
uh

591
00:31:23,149 --> 00:31:20,220
the future outer head of the qblh hands

592
00:31:25,430 --> 00:31:23,159
me a unfortunately no longer available

593
00:31:27,830 --> 00:31:25,440
as far as I know and if anybody knows

594
00:31:30,470 --> 00:31:27,840
otherwise let me know computer program

595
00:31:34,730 --> 00:31:30,480
that was extremely sophisticated because

596
00:31:42,169 --> 00:31:38,510
was a computer whiz Way Beyond almost

597
00:31:44,810 --> 00:31:42,179
anybody that you can think of including

598
00:31:47,750 --> 00:31:44,820
the people who became billionaires the

599
00:31:50,389 --> 00:31:47,760
thing is because of I mean I'm not going

600
00:31:54,710 --> 00:31:50,399
to editorialize about this too much but

601
00:31:58,130 --> 00:31:54,720
because of her insistence on addressing

602
00:32:01,450 --> 00:31:58,140
and acting as a woman at that point in

603
00:32:04,430 --> 00:32:01,460
her transition she had to work from home

604
00:32:07,430 --> 00:32:04,440
and she was doing medical programming

605
00:32:08,990 --> 00:32:07,440
for the CDC to give you some idea of the

606
00:32:10,970 --> 00:32:09,000
level of competency

607
00:32:15,950 --> 00:32:10,980
but it was one bad thing right after

608
00:32:18,110 --> 00:32:15,960
another and her life ended not well but

609
00:32:20,450 --> 00:32:18,120
at that time she was you know very

610
00:32:24,889 --> 00:32:20,460
active in qblh which I had never even

611
00:32:30,049 --> 00:32:24,899
heard of she introduced me to the uh the

612
00:32:35,889 --> 00:32:30,059
Puba uh the well-named ahead of his time

613
00:32:43,430 --> 00:32:39,710
who had been one of the co-founders of

614
00:32:44,870 --> 00:32:43,440
that way way back in 1960

615
00:32:48,889 --> 00:32:44,880
I was

616
00:32:50,210 --> 00:32:48,899
but uh but a pimply face that in high

617
00:32:53,210 --> 00:32:50,220
school

618
00:32:58,310 --> 00:32:53,220
doing what simply faced LEDs in high

619
00:33:01,669 --> 00:32:58,320
school usually do and a lot maybe five

620
00:33:01,679 --> 00:33:04,610
Alan

621
00:33:09,289 --> 00:33:06,049
Katie

622
00:33:12,409 --> 00:33:09,299
huh we don't want to hear about that

623
00:33:16,090 --> 00:33:12,419
sure you do it's all boundary that's the

624
00:33:23,750 --> 00:33:20,090
okay I'll put my pants back on now

625
00:33:26,810 --> 00:33:23,760
who is that guy on CNN who was jerking

626
00:33:29,090 --> 00:33:26,820
off while they were having a conference

627
00:33:30,830 --> 00:33:29,100
of the reporters I mean they kept him

628
00:33:34,850 --> 00:33:30,840
off the air for like six months after

629
00:33:37,789 --> 00:33:34,860
that he was lonely it was during covid

630
00:33:41,149 --> 00:33:37,799
he did he didn't go blind you know

631
00:33:43,730 --> 00:33:41,159
that we know of well no they have him

632
00:33:47,029 --> 00:33:43,740
back now and they never mention it

633
00:33:48,950 --> 00:33:47,039
and I guess he does it either and

634
00:33:52,009 --> 00:33:48,960
he puts his hands up so that everybody

635
00:33:56,029 --> 00:33:52,019
you know who knows what who knows what

636
00:33:57,169 --> 00:33:56,039
people will do or not do so

637
00:34:00,769 --> 00:33:57,179
um

638
00:34:04,970 --> 00:34:00,779
it was built to me as

639
00:34:07,909 --> 00:34:04,980
a cipher that illuminated

640
00:34:11,750 --> 00:34:07,919
occult stuff

641
00:34:14,270 --> 00:34:11,760
and that was probably During the period

642
00:34:15,710 --> 00:34:14,280
that I was beginning to have questions

643
00:34:18,109 --> 00:34:15,720
about

644
00:34:23,030 --> 00:34:18,119
the group I was in so I got involved in

645
00:34:24,770 --> 00:34:23,040
qblh simultaneously with my other

646
00:34:27,909 --> 00:34:24,780
affiliation

647
00:34:31,730 --> 00:34:27,919
consonant with since I play by the rules

648
00:34:35,629 --> 00:34:34,430
loyalties being to the

649
00:34:38,050 --> 00:34:35,639
uh

650
00:34:42,649 --> 00:34:38,060
the group that will remain

651
00:34:45,770 --> 00:34:42,659
momentarily nameless and uh

652
00:34:47,930 --> 00:34:45,780
I was not therefore as interested as I

653
00:34:50,570 --> 00:34:47,940
would have been a year before I thought

654
00:34:54,290 --> 00:34:50,580
well another occult Cipher there are so

655
00:34:57,650 --> 00:34:54,300
many and I'm familiar with uh

656
00:34:59,570 --> 00:34:57,660
uh Hebrew Kabbalah and that's a lesser

657
00:35:02,510 --> 00:34:59,580
extent Greek cabalis so I know the

658
00:35:05,030 --> 00:35:02,520
principles involved and I read some of

659
00:35:07,490 --> 00:35:05,040
the literature from the British Journal

660
00:35:09,829 --> 00:35:07,500
of ceremonial magic which the qblh by

661
00:35:10,970 --> 00:35:09,839
then had

662
00:35:14,450 --> 00:35:10,980
um

663
00:35:23,089 --> 00:35:18,230
it seemed perfectly valid

664
00:35:26,030 --> 00:35:23,099
I asked my superiors about it and my

665
00:35:28,250 --> 00:35:26,040
superiors said oh no no no no no no this

666
00:35:31,970 --> 00:35:28,260
is not a solution to that

667
00:35:35,329 --> 00:35:31,980
so I asked some more because clearly it

668
00:35:38,630 --> 00:35:35,339
was and clearly they were being uh what

669
00:35:40,490 --> 00:35:38,640
do they say in Psychology resistant

670
00:35:42,109 --> 00:35:40,500
and

671
00:35:45,349 --> 00:35:42,119
um

672
00:35:48,470 --> 00:35:45,359
I didn't go into it in depth but the

673
00:35:52,430 --> 00:35:48,480
computer program called lexicon which

674
00:35:55,550 --> 00:35:52,440
Tina had invented using I guess since

675
00:35:57,890 --> 00:35:55,560
she's long gone I can say when she was

676
00:35:59,390 --> 00:35:57,900
working at the Ford Motor Company in

677
00:36:02,210 --> 00:35:59,400
Upstate New York

678
00:36:03,550 --> 00:36:02,220
she had access to their mainframe

679
00:36:07,670 --> 00:36:03,560
computers

680
00:36:11,170 --> 00:36:07,680
and the Lexicon was developed on their

681
00:36:13,190 --> 00:36:11,180
Mainframe I once asked her well

682
00:36:17,390 --> 00:36:13,200
when you

683
00:36:19,130 --> 00:36:17,400
made it accessible to home PCS is a

684
00:36:23,390 --> 00:36:19,140
floppy disk program which is why you

685
00:36:28,550 --> 00:36:25,790
how did you remove it and said remove it

686
00:36:32,990 --> 00:36:28,560
it's probably still running there

687
00:36:35,390 --> 00:36:33,000
so agents of the Ford Motor Company

688
00:36:38,510 --> 00:36:35,400
you've got something running in the

689
00:36:41,109 --> 00:36:38,520
background on your machines

690
00:36:43,970 --> 00:36:41,119
because there are

691
00:36:45,710 --> 00:36:43,980
gazillions of alternative ciphers now

692
00:36:48,349 --> 00:36:45,720
some of the current people that I

693
00:36:50,089 --> 00:36:48,359
respect in this say they're only a

694
00:36:53,750 --> 00:36:50,099
limited number because they're a limited

695
00:36:57,290 --> 00:36:53,760
number of combinations of the 26 letters

696
00:37:00,950 --> 00:36:57,300
of the English alphabet which is where

697
00:37:04,190 --> 00:37:00,960
I think people who try to over apply

698
00:37:06,349 --> 00:37:04,200
Hebrew Kabbalah principles

699
00:37:09,530 --> 00:37:06,359
to the English Kabbalah miss out on

700
00:37:11,810 --> 00:37:09,540
because Hebrew is a 22 letter alphabet

701
00:37:15,290 --> 00:37:11,820
with no vowels

702
00:37:19,130 --> 00:37:15,300
so a lot of stuff gets Lost in

703
00:37:20,690 --> 00:37:19,140
Translation and always has

704
00:37:23,750 --> 00:37:20,700
um

705
00:37:27,410 --> 00:37:23,760
but also it

706
00:37:30,470 --> 00:37:27,420
it makes for a

707
00:37:33,349 --> 00:37:30,480
an unsmooth transition

708
00:37:37,190 --> 00:37:33,359
and we don't have a Geniuses like Tina

709
00:37:40,670 --> 00:37:37,200
around to rearrange it we have uh really

710
00:37:45,349 --> 00:37:40,680
good people with using computers too

711
00:37:48,170 --> 00:37:45,359
sort of enshrine the use of the cipher

712
00:37:49,910 --> 00:37:48,180
against the text of

713
00:37:52,069 --> 00:37:49,920
liberal

714
00:37:54,829 --> 00:37:52,079
and come up with really really

715
00:37:56,810 --> 00:37:54,839
interesting items that pertain to

716
00:37:59,270 --> 00:37:56,820
whatever the whatever number of values

717
00:38:00,349 --> 00:37:59,280
they have generated from a word or a

718
00:38:03,589 --> 00:38:00,359
phrase

719
00:38:05,270 --> 00:38:03,599
so at some point since I was not

720
00:38:10,069 --> 00:38:05,280
enthused

721
00:38:12,349 --> 00:38:10,079
but my other hat was ufology I decided

722
00:38:16,210 --> 00:38:12,359
to try it on

723
00:38:20,810 --> 00:38:16,220
some of the strange names of

724
00:38:24,470 --> 00:38:20,820
uh planets and beings that are given out

725
00:38:27,589 --> 00:38:24,480
both in classical contact elore well

726
00:38:30,650 --> 00:38:27,599
known to people in

727
00:38:31,609 --> 00:38:30,660
in ufology who don't just simply write

728
00:38:33,050 --> 00:38:31,619
the

729
00:38:35,329 --> 00:38:33,060
uh

730
00:38:37,490 --> 00:38:35,339
trans channeling or the contact team

731
00:38:38,750 --> 00:38:37,500
movement off

732
00:38:41,750 --> 00:38:38,760
um

733
00:38:44,510 --> 00:38:41,760
which is still not as many as it should

734
00:38:47,270 --> 00:38:44,520
be although I've seen some change in

735
00:38:49,370 --> 00:38:47,280
that direction at least to understanding

736
00:38:51,230 --> 00:38:49,380
that something of significance is

737
00:38:53,690 --> 00:38:51,240
involved here

738
00:38:56,990 --> 00:38:53,700
which is something that borderline

739
00:39:01,010 --> 00:38:57,000
Sciences figured out in 1945 before even

740
00:39:03,470 --> 00:39:01,020
the term Flying Saucer came into being

741
00:39:13,010 --> 00:39:07,310
I decided to try the cipher using

742
00:39:16,130 --> 00:39:13,020
lexicon on some of those names I and

743
00:39:19,730 --> 00:39:16,140
they were immediately responsive and

744
00:39:22,130 --> 00:39:19,740
very very specific ways there was a kind

745
00:39:24,589 --> 00:39:22,140
of a signal to noise ratio I mean there

746
00:39:27,829 --> 00:39:24,599
was right nonsense stuff that came

747
00:39:30,170 --> 00:39:27,839
through but the

748
00:39:32,390 --> 00:39:30,180
the probability

749
00:39:36,050 --> 00:39:32,400
and I mean that in the formal sense of

750
00:39:38,690 --> 00:39:36,060
probability theory that the hits

751
00:39:40,970 --> 00:39:38,700
were coincidental

752
00:39:44,870 --> 00:39:40,980
was

753
00:39:46,910 --> 00:39:44,880
uh smaller than most of of this the

754
00:39:50,510 --> 00:39:46,920
similar things that are found in

755
00:39:51,609 --> 00:39:50,520
academic parapsychology that lead many

756
00:39:55,190 --> 00:39:51,619
academic

757
00:39:58,130 --> 00:39:55,200
parapsychologists to say that the case

758
00:40:01,730 --> 00:39:58,140
for PSI is overwhelming

759
00:40:05,150 --> 00:40:01,740
okay so that being the case I started

760
00:40:06,829 --> 00:40:05,160
applying it to the what I then called uh

761
00:40:11,270 --> 00:40:06,839
the funny names

762
00:40:13,849 --> 00:40:11,280
in ufology came a time when I felt that

763
00:40:17,510 --> 00:40:13,859
I needed to write a book about it

764
00:40:19,150 --> 00:40:17,520
and I went down to my hometown rented a

765
00:40:22,250 --> 00:40:19,160
trailer

766
00:40:25,910 --> 00:40:22,260
and started

767
00:40:28,550 --> 00:40:25,920
writing what became seek Secret's life

768
00:40:32,030 --> 00:40:28,560
for the euphenots and then its sequel

769
00:40:34,569 --> 00:40:32,040
which was really part of one book secret

770
00:40:37,849 --> 00:40:34,579
rituals of the Men in Black

771
00:40:40,690 --> 00:40:37,859
and secret Cipher came out it was quite

772
00:40:44,270 --> 00:40:40,700
a hit at the time uh

773
00:40:48,470 --> 00:40:44,280
illuminate press of sainted memory

774
00:40:51,410 --> 00:40:48,480
uh published it and they were a

775
00:40:52,609 --> 00:40:51,420
really conscientious publisher Ron bonds

776
00:40:56,810 --> 00:40:52,619
was the

777
00:40:59,930 --> 00:40:56,820
major mover and Shaker there and he had

778
00:41:03,349 --> 00:40:59,940
a good stable of people Jim Keith Carrie

779
00:41:05,950 --> 00:41:03,359
Thornley and other

780
00:41:09,829 --> 00:41:05,960
fellow really

781
00:41:12,849 --> 00:41:09,839
esoteric writers and uh I actually even

782
00:41:14,990 --> 00:41:12,859
sold the second volume to him but

783
00:41:18,230 --> 00:41:15,000
unavoidably I've got to talk a little

784
00:41:20,510 --> 00:41:18,240
bit about my uh the Grand Master of the

785
00:41:22,790 --> 00:41:20,520
nameless order that would actually be a

786
00:41:26,450 --> 00:41:22,800
good name for an order wouldn't it the

787
00:41:31,730 --> 00:41:26,460
nameless order of antiquity

788
00:41:35,510 --> 00:41:33,710
if you want to do something

789
00:41:39,490 --> 00:41:35,520
some cult and think you need other

790
00:41:42,950 --> 00:41:39,500
people to be around you join a coven or

791
00:41:45,290 --> 00:41:42,960
become like me a free luminous

792
00:41:47,270 --> 00:41:45,300
with a bunch of credentials that I

793
00:41:50,050 --> 00:41:47,280
generally don't use but if you want to

794
00:41:53,569 --> 00:41:50,060
have some authority

795
00:41:55,550 --> 00:41:53,579
authority people it's the big thing ask

796
00:41:58,250 --> 00:41:55,560
the Pope

797
00:41:59,870 --> 00:41:58,260
ask King Charles

798
00:42:04,010 --> 00:41:59,880
I'd save him

799
00:42:09,829 --> 00:42:07,130
I can I can give because I

800
00:42:11,690 --> 00:42:09,839
I've never been a collector but I've

801
00:42:12,650 --> 00:42:11,700
been around a long time so I've gotten

802
00:42:14,329 --> 00:42:12,660
into

803
00:42:17,390 --> 00:42:14,339
Bishop

804
00:42:19,490 --> 00:42:17,400
in fact the guy that ran UFO Hunters

805
00:42:21,950 --> 00:42:19,500
what was his name uh

806
00:42:25,490 --> 00:42:21,960
is his name he's not dead

807
00:42:27,410 --> 00:42:25,500
uh first thing they take me over to the

808
00:42:31,370 --> 00:42:27,420
Redstone Arsenal

809
00:42:33,050 --> 00:42:31,380
to do a program on Nazi UFOs which is

810
00:42:36,530 --> 00:42:33,060
mostly

811
00:42:38,870 --> 00:42:36,540
uh so

812
00:42:41,870 --> 00:42:38,880
never turning anything down in those

813
00:42:44,150 --> 00:42:41,880
days I go over there and the guy who was

814
00:42:46,190 --> 00:42:44,160
Jewish looks at me and he said how can

815
00:42:50,270 --> 00:42:46,200
you be Jewish and a bishop

816
00:42:52,550 --> 00:42:50,280
I said well it's like a masonic titles

817
00:42:54,530 --> 00:42:52,560
to me it's not a

818
00:42:57,170 --> 00:42:54,540
religious title

819
00:42:58,809 --> 00:42:57,180
I have the same perfectly good religion

820
00:43:01,730 --> 00:42:58,819
you have

821
00:43:04,010 --> 00:43:01,740
and then unfortunately this whole thing

822
00:43:06,050 --> 00:43:04,020
was taped during Space Camp

823
00:43:08,870 --> 00:43:06,060
so we're at the Redstone Arsenal and he

824
00:43:11,990 --> 00:43:08,880
would ask me essentially what is

825
00:43:13,910 --> 00:43:12,000
the meaning of the Nazi UFOs and I said

826
00:43:17,050 --> 00:43:13,920
well I don't know that and the kids

827
00:43:22,309 --> 00:43:17,060
would be between classes so I don't know

828
00:43:27,710 --> 00:43:24,410
and I had forgotten the question by then

829
00:43:28,970 --> 00:43:27,720
you know well what's the answer I said

830
00:43:33,109 --> 00:43:28,980
uh

831
00:43:37,370 --> 00:43:33,119
Tippy Canoe and Tyler too because I had

832
00:43:40,309 --> 00:43:37,380
no idea what he'd asked me and the

833
00:43:43,370 --> 00:43:40,319
uh those programs don't get me started

834
00:43:45,829 --> 00:43:43,380
on that that's my second worst thing it

835
00:43:49,190 --> 00:43:45,839
even the part of the episode that I did

836
00:43:50,630 --> 00:43:49,200
ended with a Lufthansa jet carrying me

837
00:43:53,650 --> 00:43:50,640
to Germany

838
00:43:57,050 --> 00:43:53,660
I've never been on a little tons of Jet

839
00:44:00,470 --> 00:43:57,060
and I've never been to Germany

840
00:44:02,990 --> 00:44:00,480
nor do I have any particular desire to

841
00:44:07,069 --> 00:44:03,000
go there too many I'd be walking around

842
00:44:08,089 --> 00:44:07,079
on too many of my relatives so yeah [\h__\h]

843
00:44:11,510 --> 00:44:08,099
them

844
00:44:12,650 --> 00:44:11,520
um I'm sorry this is a family show

845
00:44:16,630 --> 00:44:12,660
Google

846
00:44:21,770 --> 00:44:19,970
Vinnie I think uh a question came in and

847
00:44:24,530 --> 00:44:21,780
much as I want to ask you more questions

848
00:44:26,510 --> 00:44:24,540
Alan yeah no no let's let's do it so

849
00:44:28,609 --> 00:44:26,520
Chester thank you for the ten dollars uh

850
00:44:31,190 --> 00:44:28,619
says Dr Greenfield has mentioned a third

851
00:44:33,109 --> 00:44:31,200
volume uh after secret Cipher of the

852
00:44:34,970 --> 00:44:33,119
euphinox and secret rituals of the Men

853
00:44:37,069 --> 00:44:34,980
in Black can he share when he thinks

854
00:44:39,650 --> 00:44:37,079
this will come out

855
00:44:42,290 --> 00:44:39,660
I'll try but

856
00:44:43,609 --> 00:44:42,300
um I have to say my general disclaimer

857
00:44:47,030 --> 00:44:43,619
which is

858
00:44:52,210 --> 00:44:47,040
the title of I have a title that I favor

859
00:44:56,210 --> 00:44:52,220
and I'll be glad to give it it's uh the

860
00:44:58,370 --> 00:44:56,220
real black Lodge exposed

861
00:45:02,870 --> 00:44:58,380
but I that may not wind up being the

862
00:45:06,829 --> 00:45:02,880
title and a publication date is always

863
00:45:11,930 --> 00:45:06,839
up to the publisher not to me and I even

864
00:45:12,910 --> 00:45:11,940
I've been given a series of estimates

865
00:45:17,210 --> 00:45:12,920
that

866
00:45:20,510 --> 00:45:17,220
it's coming real soon so

867
00:45:23,210 --> 00:45:20,520
is that line in Buckaroo Banzai when are

868
00:45:24,670 --> 00:45:23,220
we returning to our home planet real

869
00:45:27,530 --> 00:45:24,680
soon

870
00:45:32,930 --> 00:45:27,540
it should be out but let me let me say

871
00:45:34,730 --> 00:45:32,940
this uh the current publisher uh

872
00:45:39,370 --> 00:45:34,740
uh

873
00:45:44,930 --> 00:45:42,349
publish republishing

874
00:45:46,670 --> 00:45:44,940
secret Cipher of the euphenots and

875
00:45:49,970 --> 00:45:46,680
secret rituals of the Men in Black under

876
00:45:52,670 --> 00:45:49,980
one cover call calling it The Complete

877
00:45:55,010 --> 00:45:52,680
Secret side for the euphinox and it was

878
00:45:57,430 --> 00:45:55,020
complete at that point I had always

879
00:46:02,089 --> 00:45:57,440
envisioned a trilogy

880
00:46:04,210 --> 00:46:02,099
but because I had received a lot a lot

881
00:46:06,950 --> 00:46:04,220
of flack on the second volume

882
00:46:09,950 --> 00:46:06,960
uh uh from

883
00:46:12,470 --> 00:46:09,960
my then superiors

884
00:46:15,490 --> 00:46:12,480
it was shelves for a long time I had

885
00:46:18,710 --> 00:46:15,500
sold it I had to buy it back

886
00:46:19,849 --> 00:46:18,720
and I sat on it for years

887
00:46:23,329 --> 00:46:19,859
um

888
00:46:28,250 --> 00:46:23,339
and finally when I no longer gave a damn

889
00:46:35,390 --> 00:46:32,710
even more exhausted than me level

890
00:46:38,390 --> 00:46:35,400
I said

891
00:46:40,910 --> 00:46:38,400
go ahead and publish it and I think it

892
00:46:42,770 --> 00:46:40,920
was published

893
00:46:43,790 --> 00:46:42,780
by a publishing house that no longer

894
00:46:46,069 --> 00:46:43,800
exists

895
00:46:48,770 --> 00:46:46,079
and

896
00:46:51,290 --> 00:46:48,780
I don't know what kind of circulation it

897
00:46:53,809 --> 00:46:51,300
had I know what kind of royalties I

898
00:46:56,630 --> 00:46:53,819
didn't get because I've had good

899
00:46:59,630 --> 00:46:56,640
Publishers and I've had those that

900
00:47:00,349 --> 00:46:59,640
disappear into the ether

901
00:47:02,750 --> 00:47:00,359
um

902
00:47:05,450 --> 00:47:02,760
which most

903
00:47:07,970 --> 00:47:05,460
authors

904
00:47:11,829 --> 00:47:07,980
have some experience with along with

905
00:47:18,050 --> 00:47:13,730
and

906
00:47:26,210 --> 00:47:20,690
uh it was published as the complete

907
00:47:28,430 --> 00:47:26,220
secret Cipher and then Hellyer happened

908
00:47:32,030 --> 00:47:28,440
and uh

909
00:47:34,910 --> 00:47:32,040
my good friends at the uh

910
00:47:37,190 --> 00:47:34,920
the Planet weird

911
00:47:41,030 --> 00:47:37,200
decided to interview me principally

912
00:47:42,890 --> 00:47:41,040
because apparently the uh secret Cipher

913
00:47:45,650 --> 00:47:42,900
in the original Edition which somehow

914
00:47:47,809 --> 00:47:45,660
they had which

915
00:47:50,270 --> 00:47:47,819
that means they got it on the secondary

916
00:47:52,010 --> 00:47:50,280
Market which means they paid a

917
00:47:55,790 --> 00:47:52,020
substantial amount of money for none of

918
00:47:58,550 --> 00:47:55,800
which came into my pocket yeah

919
00:48:01,430 --> 00:47:58,560
I mean you know once it's in the

920
00:48:02,410 --> 00:48:01,440
secondary Market unless you have some

921
00:48:04,089 --> 00:48:02,420
special

922
00:48:06,170 --> 00:48:04,099
contractual

923
00:48:09,230 --> 00:48:06,180
Arrangements you don't you don't get

924
00:48:11,390 --> 00:48:09,240
royalties from that so once something

925
00:48:13,609 --> 00:48:11,400
goes out of print

926
00:48:16,609 --> 00:48:13,619
if it's something that ever had any

927
00:48:18,710 --> 00:48:16,619
popularity the price goes up and up and

928
00:48:21,170 --> 00:48:18,720
up and up several of my books were in

929
00:48:23,809 --> 00:48:21,180
the several hundred dollar range and

930
00:48:27,470 --> 00:48:23,819
I've always tried

931
00:48:29,750 --> 00:48:27,480
to to make my books very accessible to

932
00:48:32,270 --> 00:48:29,760
anybody with you know

933
00:48:33,890 --> 00:48:32,280
essentially with small change

934
00:48:35,990 --> 00:48:33,900
and

935
00:48:37,970 --> 00:48:36,000
because that's the way I like to be able

936
00:48:41,510 --> 00:48:37,980
to receive books

937
00:48:48,050 --> 00:48:45,170
it this combined Edition

938
00:48:51,589 --> 00:48:48,060
found a new generation of people

939
00:48:54,050 --> 00:48:51,599
but after hell you're

940
00:48:56,569 --> 00:48:54,060
pretty much talked about the secret

941
00:49:00,109 --> 00:48:56,579
Cipher over and over again and then in

942
00:49:02,829 --> 00:49:00,119
season two did what amounted to a

943
00:49:05,450 --> 00:49:02,839
four-hour interview with me and then

944
00:49:09,170 --> 00:49:05,460
Miracle of Miracles

945
00:49:11,870 --> 00:49:09,180
good people were actually at the helm

946
00:49:14,510 --> 00:49:11,880
not just uh you know the people in the

947
00:49:16,970 --> 00:49:14,520
front but the people in the the camera

948
00:49:19,089 --> 00:49:16,980
thing and

949
00:49:24,950 --> 00:49:19,099
shout out Carl

950
00:49:25,849 --> 00:49:24,960
my man

951
00:49:30,530 --> 00:49:25,859
um

952
00:49:34,670 --> 00:49:32,450
there I don't know how long the

953
00:49:36,530 --> 00:49:34,680
interview was because I don't watch my

954
00:49:37,150 --> 00:49:36,540
own stuff it

955
00:49:40,069 --> 00:49:37,160
it's

956
00:49:42,349 --> 00:49:40,079
cringe-worthy but uh

957
00:49:44,089 --> 00:49:42,359
well that's almost true I mean most

958
00:49:47,030 --> 00:49:44,099
people in the

959
00:49:48,470 --> 00:49:47,040
uh most people don't like to watch

960
00:49:50,210 --> 00:49:48,480
themselves

961
00:49:53,690 --> 00:49:50,220
doing this

962
00:49:57,410 --> 00:49:53,700
because I do crazy stuff and I say that

963
00:50:00,710 --> 00:49:57,420
was really silly Alan you mom

964
00:50:06,349 --> 00:50:03,170
and it feels good at the time and then

965
00:50:11,630 --> 00:50:06,359
later you you question your own sanity

966
00:50:13,370 --> 00:50:11,640
and sense of taste more importantly so

967
00:50:17,390 --> 00:50:13,380
after that

968
00:50:20,150 --> 00:50:17,400
sales of complete secret Cipher went

969
00:50:21,530 --> 00:50:20,160
through the roof and I'm still with that

970
00:50:24,250 --> 00:50:21,540
same publisher

971
00:50:27,770 --> 00:50:24,260
so all I know is

972
00:50:29,690 --> 00:50:27,780
what I'm advocating anyone wondering

973
00:50:32,750 --> 00:50:29,700
yes there it is

974
00:50:35,089 --> 00:50:32,760
get it while it's hot so

975
00:50:36,950 --> 00:50:35,099
it won't be complete if this third

976
00:50:40,370 --> 00:50:36,960
volume comes out

977
00:50:42,589 --> 00:50:40,380
and it certainly will eventually I would

978
00:50:44,569 --> 00:50:42,599
say sometime in the next few months but

979
00:50:47,270 --> 00:50:44,579
that's just a ballpark I thought it

980
00:50:49,670 --> 00:50:47,280
would be out six months now I thought it

981
00:50:52,250 --> 00:50:49,680
would be out early in the year but my

982
00:50:54,109 --> 00:50:52,260
part of it's done the only thing I have

983
00:50:55,250 --> 00:50:54,119
left to do is to read through it I'm

984
00:50:58,970 --> 00:50:55,260
certainly not going to be the

985
00:51:01,370 --> 00:50:58,980
proofreader because my proofreading is

986
00:51:04,309 --> 00:51:01,380
atrocious

987
00:51:07,069 --> 00:51:04,319
and electronic proofreading misses all

988
00:51:09,230 --> 00:51:07,079
of the technical terms that we use

989
00:51:12,849 --> 00:51:09,240
including the funny names it doesn't

990
00:51:18,410 --> 00:51:12,859
want funny names it doesn't like uh

991
00:51:21,049 --> 00:51:18,420
names of stars and names of Planet P1 my

992
00:51:23,510 --> 00:51:21,059
favorite planetary name yeah that's the

993
00:51:24,410 --> 00:51:23,520
one that it's a good one yeah it's a

994
00:51:26,510 --> 00:51:24,420
great one

995
00:51:29,150 --> 00:51:26,520
we use that in fact for a friend of

996
00:51:33,049 --> 00:51:29,160
mine's ex-wife we say she she was

997
00:51:35,870 --> 00:51:33,059
visiting from planet P1 they had a very

998
00:51:40,190 --> 00:51:35,880
very very unpleasant

999
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:43,010
and plus

1000
00:51:43,020 --> 00:51:47,210
she loved it

1001
00:51:51,349 --> 00:51:49,069
but so Hillier got your work a lot more

1002
00:51:53,510 --> 00:51:51,359
attention I think a lot of people a new

1003
00:51:57,170 --> 00:51:53,520
generation of folks came to your work

1004
00:52:01,930 --> 00:51:57,180
from Hellier yes and interestingly

1005
00:52:06,109 --> 00:52:01,940
enough whereas in American ufology

1006
00:52:12,250 --> 00:52:06,119
I have always been a voice crying in the

1007
00:52:20,510 --> 00:52:17,390
I suppose a view not unlike Valais his

1008
00:52:24,910 --> 00:52:20,520
credentials are in hard science minor in

1009
00:52:28,190 --> 00:52:24,920
humanity so I don't get that you know

1010
00:52:29,809 --> 00:52:28,200
that kind of attention because what I

1011
00:52:33,829 --> 00:52:29,819
say is

1012
00:52:37,910 --> 00:52:33,839
what you hear on various not present

1013
00:52:40,370 --> 00:52:37,920
company accepted from deranged sources

1014
00:52:44,270 --> 00:52:40,380
on YouTube

1015
00:52:49,089 --> 00:52:44,280
you know it's possible

1016
00:52:51,950 --> 00:52:49,099
that Trump is Jesus and here's the proof

1017
00:52:54,710 --> 00:52:51,960
whatever you know there are a lot of

1018
00:52:57,940 --> 00:52:54,720
crazies out there and they love seeing

1019
00:53:01,370 --> 00:52:57,950
themselves on deep

1020
00:53:03,349 --> 00:53:01,380
[Laughter]

1021
00:53:08,410 --> 00:53:03,359
I don't of course

1022
00:53:16,089 --> 00:53:13,190
I still have my teeth hair still got the

1023
00:53:20,690 --> 00:53:18,950
we believe you

1024
00:53:24,710 --> 00:53:20,700
well I had to pull it though otherwise

1025
00:53:28,849 --> 00:53:27,230
I have like a thousand Hellier related

1026
00:53:30,170 --> 00:53:28,859
questions but I want to give you a

1027
00:53:32,990 --> 00:53:30,180
chance to ask

1028
00:53:35,150 --> 00:53:33,000
some of yours too yeah no I just I think

1029
00:53:38,930 --> 00:53:35,160
it makes sense to us when it comes to

1030
00:53:41,089 --> 00:53:38,940
your research both in the occult and in

1031
00:53:42,890 --> 00:53:41,099
ufology how do you tie that together

1032
00:53:44,569 --> 00:53:42,900
because I know a lot of people come from

1033
00:53:46,549 --> 00:53:44,579
like a nuts and bolts background but

1034
00:53:49,309 --> 00:53:46,559
then you've got the Consciousness aspect

1035
00:53:51,650 --> 00:53:49,319
so how do you tile that in with a

1036
00:53:55,849 --> 00:53:51,660
cultism as well

1037
00:54:00,770 --> 00:53:55,859
I am so glad you asked that question

1038
00:54:05,930 --> 00:54:00,780
look uh I don't know anyone

1039
00:54:09,410 --> 00:54:05,940
of the first gen or second gen

1040
00:54:10,970 --> 00:54:09,420
ufologist and that second gen is my

1041
00:54:13,010 --> 00:54:10,980
generation

1042
00:54:19,089 --> 00:54:13,020
it didn't start off

1043
00:54:21,890 --> 00:54:19,099
not only with eth as their most probable

1044
00:54:24,170 --> 00:54:21,900
non-conventional solution

1045
00:54:26,329 --> 00:54:24,180
but

1046
00:54:41,870 --> 00:54:26,339
that

1047
00:54:45,950 --> 00:54:41,880
involved

1048
00:54:49,069 --> 00:54:45,960
the thing is as the late Gene duplantier

1049
00:54:52,970 --> 00:54:49,079
of salsa Space and Science

1050
00:54:54,890 --> 00:54:52,980
put it when he put out his last issue

1051
00:54:58,190 --> 00:54:54,900
and this is the way a lot of people left

1052
00:55:01,250 --> 00:54:58,200
ufology it's like I've never forgotten

1053
00:55:05,210 --> 00:55:01,260
the exact phrase It's like a long walk

1054
00:55:08,450 --> 00:55:05,220
down an endless tube well I knew the

1055
00:55:12,109 --> 00:55:08,460
phenomena happened

1056
00:55:15,890 --> 00:55:12,119
and I knew that it extended way way way

1057
00:55:18,470 --> 00:55:15,900
Beyond lights in the sky and the lights

1058
00:55:20,270 --> 00:55:18,480
in the sky can be almost anything you

1059
00:55:22,910 --> 00:55:20,280
know you can

1060
00:55:26,990 --> 00:55:22,920
it could be I know this is incredible

1061
00:55:30,410 --> 00:55:27,000
but they could be balloons from China I

1062
00:55:31,609 --> 00:55:30,420
mean anything is possible right so you

1063
00:55:34,510 --> 00:55:31,619
don't want to talk about the Chinese

1064
00:55:41,510 --> 00:55:38,089
no more Chinese balloon

1065
00:55:44,210 --> 00:55:41,520
if you got away from Knockouts mentality

1066
00:55:45,230 --> 00:55:44,220
which is they're real you can see them

1067
00:55:48,049 --> 00:55:45,240
anywhere

1068
00:55:49,809 --> 00:55:48,059
but in effect they were saying but they

1069
00:55:52,549 --> 00:55:49,819
don't land

1070
00:55:56,089 --> 00:55:52,559
at least afro

1071
00:56:00,109 --> 00:55:56,099
their Chief rival back in the day said

1072
00:56:02,569 --> 00:56:00,119
well they do land and some of the cases

1073
00:56:06,410 --> 00:56:02,579
of

1074
00:56:08,870 --> 00:56:06,420
ce2 and ce3 type cases

1075
00:56:11,030 --> 00:56:08,880
close encounter cases

1076
00:56:13,030 --> 00:56:11,040
actually happen and are worthy of

1077
00:56:16,069 --> 00:56:13,040
Investigation

1078
00:56:19,849 --> 00:56:16,079
and mufon which was a late Comer

1079
00:56:22,750 --> 00:56:19,859
probably the last of the classical large

1080
00:56:24,710 --> 00:56:22,760
UFO organizations originally the Midwest

1081
00:56:28,670 --> 00:56:24,720
UFO Network

1082
00:56:32,950 --> 00:56:28,680
later under the guidance of Walt Andrus

1083
00:56:36,230 --> 00:56:32,960
and John schustler uh

1084
00:56:38,329 --> 00:56:36,240
high-tech type well no middle attack

1085
00:56:40,150 --> 00:56:38,339
type guys you know essentially

1086
00:56:43,849 --> 00:56:40,160
engineering types

1087
00:56:47,809 --> 00:56:43,859
they were very eth but uh their

1088
00:56:51,710 --> 00:56:47,819
membership was a bit more open to

1089
00:56:52,870 --> 00:56:51,720
more esoteric explanations not

1090
00:56:56,329 --> 00:56:52,880
necessarily

1091
00:56:59,990 --> 00:56:56,339
anti-eth but like that leaves some kind

1092
00:57:01,010 --> 00:57:00,000
of gaps that we need to examine in the

1093
00:57:02,470 --> 00:57:01,020
meantime

1094
00:57:06,049 --> 00:57:02,480
I read

1095
00:57:07,569 --> 00:57:06,059
metvale once before he got involved with

1096
00:57:13,609 --> 00:57:07,579
uh

1097
00:57:18,049 --> 00:57:13,619
I met him with

1098
00:57:22,250 --> 00:57:18,059
Jim Mosley and Gene Steinberg and Rick

1099
00:57:27,109 --> 00:57:22,260
hillberg on our way to an invited trip

1100
00:57:30,829 --> 00:57:27,119
to see Ray Palmer the legendary

1101
00:57:33,470 --> 00:57:30,839
uh more or less in a sense has been

1102
00:57:35,990 --> 00:57:33,480
accused of being the founder of flying

1103
00:57:39,890 --> 00:57:36,000
saucers because he was

1104
00:57:42,849 --> 00:57:39,900
Richard Shaver's original publisher and

1105
00:57:47,950 --> 00:57:42,859
very eccentric and one of the first

1106
00:57:54,770 --> 00:57:52,010
Ray had invited us up after we had

1107
00:57:57,530 --> 00:57:54,780
Earnest young men that we were had gone

1108
00:58:00,230 --> 00:57:57,540
to 1536 Connecticut Avenue in Washington

1109
00:58:02,569 --> 00:58:00,240
which is very near where klatu was

1110
00:58:04,670 --> 00:58:02,579
killed actually that's

1111
00:58:06,349 --> 00:58:04,680
not coincidental

1112
00:58:09,530 --> 00:58:06,359
um

1113
00:58:12,290 --> 00:58:09,540
so we went to their office

1114
00:58:14,390 --> 00:58:12,300
they saw Steinberg and they said he has

1115
00:58:18,470 --> 00:58:14,400
to leave

1116
00:58:22,609 --> 00:58:18,480
and I said uh to the late

1117
00:58:23,809 --> 00:58:22,619
Richard Dickey Hall sir we came as a

1118
00:58:27,770 --> 00:58:23,819
group

1119
00:58:29,630 --> 00:58:27,780
Gene is our friend if he has to leave we

1120
00:58:30,710 --> 00:58:29,640
all have to leave and he said well if

1121
00:58:32,870 --> 00:58:30,720
that's the way it's going to be that's

1122
00:58:35,089 --> 00:58:32,880
the way it's going to be so we laughed

1123
00:58:38,690 --> 00:58:35,099
went back to our hotel room

1124
00:58:41,089 --> 00:58:38,700
and did the obvious thing we called Ray

1125
00:58:43,190 --> 00:58:41,099
Palmer and cried our eyes out and he

1126
00:58:46,930 --> 00:58:43,200
said well come on up to Amherst

1127
00:58:51,049 --> 00:58:46,940
Wisconsin I won't throw you out

1128
00:58:54,109 --> 00:58:51,059
so we stopped off in Chicago and met

1129
00:58:56,630 --> 00:58:54,119
with Dr heineck and met with valet who

1130
00:58:59,030 --> 00:58:56,640
has recounted that meeting but doesn't

1131
00:59:01,789 --> 00:58:59,040
mention my name anywhere it was just no

1132
00:59:05,329 --> 00:59:01,799
importance the big guy at that meeting

1133
00:59:06,410 --> 00:59:05,339
was Jim Mosley because Jim was at that

1134
00:59:09,829 --> 00:59:06,420
time

1135
00:59:16,010 --> 00:59:09,839
uh well he was my idol and he was also

1136
00:59:18,829 --> 00:59:16,020
uh a a very famous ufologist in first

1137
00:59:21,829 --> 00:59:18,839
gen ufology along with gray Barker and

1138
00:59:26,210 --> 00:59:21,839
other what I came to call middle

1139
00:59:29,569 --> 00:59:26,220
ufologists that has not contactees

1140
00:59:32,589 --> 00:59:29,579
and not nuts and bolts science types but

1141
00:59:35,690 --> 00:59:32,599
somewhere in between and mostly actually

1142
00:59:39,109 --> 00:59:35,700
well-educated people who had some sense

1143
00:59:42,109 --> 00:59:39,119
of discernment Beyond some background in

1144
00:59:45,349 --> 00:59:42,119
philosophy I mean Jim was a

1145
00:59:47,809 --> 00:59:45,359
Princeton man I think and one of my best

1146
00:59:51,230 --> 00:59:47,819
friends over the long home

1147
00:59:54,049 --> 00:59:51,240
so anyway uh

1148
00:59:57,829 --> 00:59:54,059
where was I going with that okay so

1149
01:00:01,010 --> 00:59:57,839
other than at that time

1150
01:00:04,430 --> 01:00:01,020
the lay and his wife Janine

1151
01:00:06,349 --> 01:00:04,440
had written a book which was I've even

1152
01:00:08,030 --> 01:00:06,359
forgotten the name of it anatomy of a

1153
01:00:10,490 --> 01:00:08,040
phenomena that's it

1154
01:00:15,130 --> 01:00:10,500
very conservative

1155
01:00:17,990 --> 01:00:15,140
not much different from keho's books or

1156
01:00:20,630 --> 01:00:18,000
the one bestseller that there has ever

1157
01:00:23,990 --> 01:00:20,640
been in regular

1158
01:00:26,329 --> 01:00:24,000
UFO lore that was Frank Edwards uh

1159
01:00:28,190 --> 01:00:26,339
flying source of serious business which

1160
01:00:30,530 --> 01:00:28,200
was very influential at the time made

1161
01:00:32,630 --> 01:00:30,540
the New York Times bestseller list and

1162
01:00:34,609 --> 01:00:32,640
this is before passport to Magonia yes

1163
01:00:37,069 --> 01:00:34,619
yes yeah

1164
01:00:40,450 --> 01:00:37,079
only like a year or two before but a

1165
01:00:44,690 --> 01:00:40,460
year or two before so passport comes out

1166
01:00:47,329 --> 01:00:44,700
I read it and I go

1167
01:00:51,349 --> 01:00:47,339
this makes a lot more sense

1168
01:00:56,690 --> 01:00:51,359
than eth it doesn't explain because the

1169
01:00:58,789 --> 01:00:56,700
underlying guts of why this happens

1170
01:01:01,190 --> 01:00:58,799
he even says at the beginning I don't

1171
01:01:04,730 --> 01:01:01,200
write this as a scientist I write this

1172
01:01:06,230 --> 01:01:04,740
as you know essentially is a ufologist

1173
01:01:08,630 --> 01:01:06,240
which I don't believe he's ever called

1174
01:01:10,609 --> 01:01:08,640
himself but that's that's the way I

1175
01:01:12,230 --> 01:01:10,619
would interpret that

1176
01:01:15,309 --> 01:01:12,240
um

1177
01:01:18,609 --> 01:01:15,319
and from that point on I was an advocate

1178
01:01:22,270 --> 01:01:18,619
of the notion that there was

1179
01:01:24,950 --> 01:01:22,280
something fundamentally wrong with eth

1180
01:01:27,349 --> 01:01:24,960
and the only thing I could come up with

1181
01:01:31,370 --> 01:01:27,359
was without

1182
01:01:36,770 --> 01:01:31,380
deep scientific backing

1183
01:01:38,630 --> 01:01:36,780
that the anomalous nature of UFOs and a

1184
01:01:43,630 --> 01:01:38,640
lot of other phenomena

1185
01:01:48,650 --> 01:01:46,089
hauntings

1186
01:01:50,150 --> 01:01:48,660
Cryptids especially

1187
01:01:51,890 --> 01:01:50,160
uh

1188
01:01:55,069 --> 01:01:51,900
fairy lore

1189
01:01:58,730 --> 01:01:55,079
which was something that uh

1190
01:02:01,609 --> 01:01:58,740
that the lay focused on right seemed to

1191
01:02:04,789 --> 01:02:01,619
all follow exactly the same pattern even

1192
01:02:07,130 --> 01:02:04,799
the same pattern that draws people into

1193
01:02:10,549 --> 01:02:07,140
being fascinated by it and forming

1194
01:02:13,430 --> 01:02:10,559
organizations the ferry research Society

1195
01:02:15,710 --> 01:02:13,440
had this uh the original had the same

1196
01:02:17,150 --> 01:02:15,720
structure that later UFO organizations

1197
01:02:21,589 --> 01:02:17,160
had

1198
01:02:23,930 --> 01:02:21,599
only it was investigating reports of the

1199
01:02:26,030 --> 01:02:23,940
Fey the fairies the

1200
01:02:27,470 --> 01:02:26,040
the little people whatever you want to

1201
01:02:31,549 --> 01:02:27,480
call them which is a worldwide

1202
01:02:34,010 --> 01:02:31,559
phenomenon and has been documented for a

1203
01:02:37,010 --> 01:02:34,020
very long time going back at least to

1204
01:02:40,030 --> 01:02:37,020
the 19th century but certainly the

1205
01:02:43,670 --> 01:02:40,040
phenomenon goes back to as remote

1206
01:02:46,190 --> 01:02:43,680
Antiquity as you care to go right so if

1207
01:02:49,549 --> 01:02:46,200
it follows the same pattern UFOs and you

1208
01:02:52,250 --> 01:02:49,559
investigate UFO cases you find it's the

1209
01:02:54,950 --> 01:02:52,260
same sort of thing

1210
01:02:56,690 --> 01:02:54,960
um you begin to think that there must be

1211
01:02:58,970 --> 01:02:56,700
a convergence

1212
01:03:01,849 --> 01:02:58,980
at some point are these different

1213
01:03:05,809 --> 01:03:01,859
aspects of the same phenomena I asked

1214
01:03:07,789 --> 01:03:05,819
rhetorically of myself and came out with

1215
01:03:10,970 --> 01:03:07,799
a little thing called alternate Horizons

1216
01:03:14,230 --> 01:03:10,980
newsletter this was way way pre-internet

1217
01:03:18,890 --> 01:03:14,240
so we would all crank out our little

1218
01:03:20,150 --> 01:03:18,900
mimeograph newsletters or since my

1219
01:03:23,589 --> 01:03:20,160
family was

1220
01:03:25,390 --> 01:03:23,599
well to do unlike me today

1221
01:03:28,609 --> 01:03:25,400
but

1222
01:03:34,130 --> 01:03:28,619
so I was able to get them printed

1223
01:03:37,549 --> 01:03:34,140
but with one draft because I was even

1224
01:03:40,789 --> 01:03:37,559
then the worst proofreader That Ever

1225
01:03:42,890 --> 01:03:40,799
Walked the face of the Earth so they had

1226
01:03:44,510 --> 01:03:42,900
lots of little embarrassing errors and

1227
01:03:47,210 --> 01:03:44,520
unfortunately

1228
01:03:48,890 --> 01:03:47,220
a lot of them are up on the internet now

1229
01:03:52,309 --> 01:03:48,900
I don't know if you're around long

1230
01:03:54,770 --> 01:03:52,319
enough everything you ever did every

1231
01:03:57,230 --> 01:03:54,780
letter you ever wrote every letter that

1232
01:03:59,150 --> 01:03:57,240
was ever written to you is plastered

1233
01:04:01,370 --> 01:03:59,160
somewhere on the internet and if it's

1234
01:04:03,069 --> 01:04:01,380
disappeared it's on the Wayback machines

1235
01:04:05,930 --> 01:04:03,079
okay

1236
01:04:08,089 --> 01:04:05,940
you know well you you were mention

1237
01:04:10,490 --> 01:04:08,099
anything about contactees though and

1238
01:04:12,470 --> 01:04:10,500
that got me thinking if you don't if you

1239
01:04:15,589 --> 01:04:12,480
don't mind you mentioned in secret

1240
01:04:17,150 --> 01:04:15,599
Cipher that you know prior to some of

1241
01:04:21,170 --> 01:04:17,160
these ciphers being cracked sometime in

1242
01:04:23,390 --> 01:04:21,180
the 70s we see a lot of UFO flaps a lot

1243
01:04:26,210 --> 01:04:23,400
of like personal contact with aliens

1244
01:04:27,650 --> 01:04:26,220
with funny names or I see I put aliens

1245
01:04:28,430 --> 01:04:27,660
in quotes

1246
01:04:30,710 --> 01:04:28,440
um

1247
01:04:33,049 --> 01:04:30,720
but that now we're going more towards

1248
01:04:35,750 --> 01:04:33,059
like the trans mediumship and individual

1249
01:04:38,450 --> 01:04:35,760
contact ce5 that kind of thing and this

1250
01:04:41,329 --> 01:04:38,460
got me thinking about the SDS method

1251
01:04:43,309 --> 01:04:41,339
sessions which you know for folks who

1252
01:04:45,230 --> 01:04:43,319
aren't familiar it's basically a

1253
01:04:48,829 --> 01:04:45,240
digitally

1254
01:04:51,410 --> 01:04:48,839
um assisted version of trans mediumship

1255
01:04:53,450 --> 01:04:51,420
um and two of the folks involved in

1256
01:04:56,990 --> 01:04:53,460
Hellyer actually developed the the the

1257
01:04:58,970 --> 01:04:57,000
method uh Connor and Carl and one of the

1258
01:05:01,010 --> 01:04:58,980
things the Hellyer crew jokes about and

1259
01:05:03,670 --> 01:05:01,020
I've even experienced this myself is

1260
01:05:06,710 --> 01:05:03,680
that once you try to use the SDS method

1261
01:05:09,470 --> 01:05:06,720
to contact supposed non-human

1262
01:05:12,109 --> 01:05:09,480
intelligence whatever you envision that

1263
01:05:13,270 --> 01:05:12,119
to be it's almost impossible to get them

1264
01:05:15,349 --> 01:05:13,280
to shut up

1265
01:05:18,950 --> 01:05:15,359
they seem to want to come back

1266
01:05:20,510 --> 01:05:18,960
repeatedly or whatever they are

1267
01:05:22,130 --> 01:05:20,520
um and so I just want to ask you know

1268
01:05:23,809 --> 01:05:22,140
have you ever tried the Essie's method

1269
01:05:25,789 --> 01:05:23,819
what do you think is going on do you

1270
01:05:30,230 --> 01:05:25,799
think there's anything too

1271
01:05:32,270 --> 01:05:30,240
that uh version of contacty

1272
01:05:36,890 --> 01:05:32,280
relationships

1273
01:05:40,010 --> 01:05:36,900
well I think classical mediumship

1274
01:05:45,230 --> 01:05:43,010
is compromised by the number of fakes

1275
01:05:47,569 --> 01:05:45,240
particularly with physical mediumship

1276
01:05:51,170 --> 01:05:47,579
but that doesn't mean that it's all

1277
01:05:53,089 --> 01:05:51,180
thing the problem is that's a real

1278
01:05:57,349 --> 01:05:53,099
difficult area to find the signal to

1279
01:05:58,750 --> 01:05:57,359
noise ratio and back in the days when

1280
01:06:02,210 --> 01:05:58,760
there was

1281
01:06:06,170 --> 01:06:02,220
serious parapsychological Research into

1282
01:06:09,410 --> 01:06:06,180
mediumship mostly done by the society

1283
01:06:12,609 --> 01:06:09,420
for psychical research and the American

1284
01:06:16,069 --> 01:06:12,619
equivalent the aspr

1285
01:06:19,309 --> 01:06:16,079
I was an elected member of the svr for a

1286
01:06:21,770 --> 01:06:19,319
while and they still trudge on you know

1287
01:06:23,690 --> 01:06:21,780
they're still there but they seem to

1288
01:06:25,150 --> 01:06:23,700
have a less

1289
01:06:27,829 --> 01:06:25,160
uh

1290
01:06:30,410 --> 01:06:27,839
lesser focus on that sort of thing which

1291
01:06:33,049 --> 01:06:30,420
is unfortunate because they're founding

1292
01:06:38,390 --> 01:06:33,059
members and the first generation after

1293
01:06:44,390 --> 01:06:41,690
expert in a wide variety of fields and

1294
01:06:47,690 --> 01:06:44,400
I'll get back to why a wide variety of

1295
01:06:49,789 --> 01:06:47,700
fields is crucial to having any

1296
01:06:51,770 --> 01:06:49,799
understanding of these things if you

1297
01:06:54,950 --> 01:06:51,780
remind me to get back to that because

1298
01:06:57,829 --> 01:06:54,960
some people say that I wander but you

1299
01:07:00,950 --> 01:06:57,839
know it's it's just people

1300
01:07:06,910 --> 01:07:02,450
JD

1301
01:07:14,569 --> 01:07:10,910
despite what they say I'm a nice guy

1302
01:07:20,990 --> 01:07:17,390
I like me a lot too but

1303
01:07:22,970 --> 01:07:21,000
no actually I don't but uh

1304
01:07:24,730 --> 01:07:22,980
where was I

1305
01:07:29,930 --> 01:07:24,740
think

1306
01:07:34,250 --> 01:07:29,940
okay yes I have um I wanted to say that

1307
01:07:37,609 --> 01:07:34,260
beginning in the 1940s with borderline

1308
01:07:41,390 --> 01:07:37,619
Sciences which is still around uh I'll

1309
01:07:43,910 --> 01:07:41,400
be at their leadership has changed over

1310
01:07:46,130 --> 01:07:43,920
and over and over and there have been

1311
01:07:47,029 --> 01:07:46,140
good periods and bad periods but back in

1312
01:07:50,569 --> 01:07:47,039
the day

1313
01:07:52,250 --> 01:07:50,579
it was organized by Meade Lane who is in

1314
01:07:55,670 --> 01:07:52,260
the complete secret site for the

1315
01:07:58,190 --> 01:07:55,680
euphenots uh because he was

1316
01:08:00,069 --> 01:07:58,200
quite an influence on me

1317
01:08:01,809 --> 01:08:00,079
and

1318
01:08:05,329 --> 01:08:01,819
he

1319
01:08:08,210 --> 01:08:05,339
began looking into

1320
01:08:11,650 --> 01:08:08,220
not only the mystery of what he called

1321
01:08:15,529 --> 01:08:11,660
the Guardians the uh basically UFOs

1322
01:08:17,090 --> 01:08:15,539
which they started looking at 1945 when

1323
01:08:20,050 --> 01:08:17,100
they were

1324
01:08:22,610 --> 01:08:20,060
a new organization

1325
01:08:25,130 --> 01:08:22,620
long before the international flying

1326
01:08:27,349 --> 01:08:25,140
salsa Bureau or apro which

1327
01:08:30,410 --> 01:08:27,359
have been variously claimed to be the

1328
01:08:33,829 --> 01:08:30,420
first flying saucer groups

1329
01:08:38,990 --> 01:08:36,110
they immediately

1330
01:08:42,110 --> 01:08:39,000
became interested in classical trans

1331
01:08:44,450 --> 01:08:42,120
channeling that applied not to the

1332
01:08:46,030 --> 01:08:44,460
spirits of the Dead

1333
01:08:49,849 --> 01:08:46,040
but to

1334
01:08:52,610 --> 01:08:49,859
ascended masters unlike most groups that

1335
01:08:56,709 --> 01:08:52,620
got involved in that they did not have a

1336
01:09:00,050 --> 01:08:56,719
basis in William Dudley pelly's

1337
01:09:02,749 --> 01:09:00,060
fascist organizations from the 1930s

1338
01:09:05,229 --> 01:09:02,759
which have had many derivatives coming

1339
01:09:07,669 --> 01:09:05,239
up even unto today

1340
01:09:08,349 --> 01:09:07,679
uh so

1341
01:09:11,450 --> 01:09:08,359
um

1342
01:09:13,570 --> 01:09:11,460
their strain of Trance

1343
01:09:16,249 --> 01:09:13,580
channeling mostly

1344
01:09:18,289 --> 01:09:16,259
through the very talented Channel Mark

1345
01:09:20,990 --> 01:09:18,299
Probert

1346
01:09:22,440 --> 01:09:21,000
um I'm not convinced

1347
01:09:23,689 --> 01:09:22,450
that there are sources

1348
01:09:25,789 --> 01:09:23,699
[Music]

1349
01:09:27,769 --> 01:09:25,799
were

1350
01:09:31,189 --> 01:09:27,779
telling the truth

1351
01:09:33,110 --> 01:09:31,199
that's an interesting thing but I am

1352
01:09:35,510 --> 01:09:33,120
convinced that their sources were

1353
01:09:37,970 --> 01:09:35,520
sources it wasn't you know stuff they

1354
01:09:40,189 --> 01:09:37,980
were making up as they went along and

1355
01:09:43,610 --> 01:09:40,199
then you come through the period of the

1356
01:09:47,630 --> 01:09:43,620
cess material and the raw material the

1357
01:09:51,189 --> 01:09:47,640
raw material I sort of I knew the people

1358
01:09:52,729 --> 01:09:51,199
who generated that uh

1359
01:09:55,729 --> 01:09:52,739
uh

1360
01:09:58,189 --> 01:09:55,739
Don Elkins who was an Eastern Airline

1361
01:10:00,229 --> 01:09:58,199
Pilot by day and a trans Channel by

1362
01:10:02,810 --> 01:10:00,239
night I've been president when he

1363
01:10:05,030 --> 01:10:02,820
channeled in my own living room and

1364
01:10:07,990 --> 01:10:05,040
Carla ruckert who was a good good friend

1365
01:10:11,209 --> 01:10:08,000
of mine they had no

1366
01:10:13,010 --> 01:10:11,219
Doctrine to go with the Trans channeling

1367
01:10:14,750 --> 01:10:13,020
stuff that they did and that's

1368
01:10:17,630 --> 01:10:14,760
relatively unique you know they said

1369
01:10:19,910 --> 01:10:17,640
take this stuff for what it's worth we

1370
01:10:23,709 --> 01:10:19,920
think it's worth a lot we can teach

1371
01:10:27,830 --> 01:10:23,719
anybody to do this anybody

1372
01:10:30,590 --> 01:10:27,840
and they seem to be not just legit but

1373
01:10:34,490 --> 01:10:30,600
Ultra legit and not in it in any sense

1374
01:10:35,990 --> 01:10:34,500
for the for the money right come forward

1375
01:10:39,050 --> 01:10:36,000
in time

1376
01:10:40,930 --> 01:10:39,060
to uh

1377
01:10:44,450 --> 01:10:40,940
what's the name of that hotel

1378
01:10:46,550 --> 01:10:44,460
Stanley Stanley Hotel welcome to

1379
01:10:53,750 --> 01:10:46,560
Colorado

1380
01:10:59,149 --> 01:10:56,990
you can find them here Stanley Kubrick's

1381
01:11:01,490 --> 01:10:59,159
near

1382
01:11:03,649 --> 01:11:01,500
so

1383
01:11:08,810 --> 01:11:03,659
I made that up just now

1384
01:11:12,590 --> 01:11:10,490
why not other people have look at Dr

1385
01:11:18,370 --> 01:11:12,600
sleep

1386
01:11:23,870 --> 01:11:20,630
you don't remember that I just said that

1387
01:11:27,649 --> 01:11:23,880
oh well what you were saying was what

1388
01:11:29,290 --> 01:11:27,659
about the sg's method yes I do have the

1389
01:11:34,790 --> 01:11:29,300
devices

1390
01:11:37,850 --> 01:11:34,800
and I have tried the sg's method and

1391
01:11:41,689 --> 01:11:37,860
I think that it works but it works in a

1392
01:11:44,149 --> 01:11:41,699
way a little bit more peculiar than

1393
01:11:46,669 --> 01:11:44,159
simply skipping from channel to channel

1394
01:11:49,550 --> 01:11:46,679
what happens is I completely agree yeah

1395
01:11:52,370 --> 01:11:49,560
you go through that for a while and you

1396
01:11:54,470 --> 01:11:52,380
cut off in a sensory thing and I've done

1397
01:11:56,630 --> 01:11:54,480
isolation tanks I don't know if that's

1398
01:11:59,590 --> 01:11:56,640
way before your day or if you've heard

1399
01:12:02,930 --> 01:11:59,600
of them but that's

1400
01:12:04,490 --> 01:12:02,940
I have an appointment next month for one

1401
01:12:07,550 --> 01:12:04,500
first time so

1402
01:12:12,610 --> 01:12:10,430
how are you on claustrophobia

1403
01:12:15,169 --> 01:12:12,620
not great

1404
01:12:18,770 --> 01:12:15,179
okay make sure it's one of those where

1405
01:12:23,149 --> 01:12:18,780
the door opens from the inside and

1406
01:12:25,729 --> 01:12:23,159
there's no lock on the outside okay

1407
01:12:29,930 --> 01:12:25,739
because once you get in the dark and

1408
01:12:31,270 --> 01:12:29,940
you're floating you lose most bodily

1409
01:12:36,770 --> 01:12:31,280
Sensations

1410
01:12:39,729 --> 01:12:36,780
stop I'm excited for it okay

1411
01:12:41,950 --> 01:12:39,739
I'll be there with you

1412
01:12:45,649 --> 01:12:41,960
back to Estes

1413
01:12:48,169 --> 01:12:45,659
okay so well the point is it works in

1414
01:12:50,810 --> 01:12:48,179
the sort of the same way except it's not

1415
01:12:55,490 --> 01:12:50,820
a whole body experience but if you cut

1416
01:12:57,770 --> 01:12:55,500
yourself off from uh Sight and Sound

1417
01:12:59,570 --> 01:12:57,780
uh and then there's the other end of it

1418
01:13:00,530 --> 01:12:59,580
that questions are being asked that you

1419
01:13:03,590 --> 01:13:00,540
can't hear

1420
01:13:06,770 --> 01:13:03,600
and you're listening to the

1421
01:13:10,430 --> 01:13:06,780
I guess FM radio is skipping through its

1422
01:13:13,910 --> 01:13:10,440
Channels with this little Chinese device

1423
01:13:17,209 --> 01:13:13,920
uh which usually costs 19.95 and comes

1424
01:13:19,390 --> 01:13:17,219
straight from uh Shanghai and it's going

1425
01:13:23,209 --> 01:13:19,400
back 30

1426
01:13:26,090 --> 01:13:23,219
21. at some point you're no longer

1427
01:13:28,250 --> 01:13:26,100
hearing those you think you are but

1428
01:13:32,209 --> 01:13:28,260
you're hearing words that are not being

1429
01:13:34,370 --> 01:13:32,219
said by various Radio broadcasters I

1430
01:13:37,250 --> 01:13:34,380
always wondered what do you do if you do

1431
01:13:40,310 --> 01:13:37,260
that on an AM radio stations and there's

1432
01:13:44,530 --> 01:13:40,320
nothing left on am but Ultra Ultra right

1433
01:13:50,630 --> 01:13:48,169
yes really racist non-human intelligence

1434
01:13:53,390 --> 01:13:50,640
man yes

1435
01:13:55,149 --> 01:13:53,400
and we all know about replacement theory

1436
01:13:58,490 --> 01:13:55,159
of a replacement

1437
01:14:00,649 --> 01:13:58,500
but you stop hearing it and my hunch is

1438
01:14:02,390 --> 01:14:00,659
the same thing would happen no matter

1439
01:14:05,090 --> 01:14:02,400
what frequency you're on try it with

1440
01:14:08,390 --> 01:14:05,100
shortwave I think would be really

1441
01:14:11,870 --> 01:14:08,400
interesting anyway I found that you

1442
01:14:14,570 --> 01:14:11,880
start to drift into

1443
01:14:17,570 --> 01:14:14,580
a Paranormal State of Consciousness

1444
01:14:20,630 --> 01:14:17,580
which is very altered from ordinary

1445
01:14:23,510 --> 01:14:20,640
Consciousness and then you start to

1446
01:14:26,510 --> 01:14:23,520
without knowing it being responsive to

1447
01:14:28,910 --> 01:14:26,520
what's being asked of you by an external

1448
01:14:31,550 --> 01:14:28,920
source and that's how it becomes

1449
01:14:35,209 --> 01:14:31,560
responsive or if you're doing it alone

1450
01:14:38,950 --> 01:14:35,219
if you are recording what you

1451
01:14:40,850 --> 01:14:38,960
hear by saying it you know

1452
01:14:43,850 --> 01:14:40,860
transmutation

1453
01:14:45,770 --> 01:14:43,860
they don't say that on radio ever they

1454
01:14:50,090 --> 01:14:45,780
don't know the word anything more than

1455
01:14:53,750 --> 01:14:50,100
three syllables you know is unlikely

1456
01:14:56,570 --> 01:14:55,250
no I'm glad that I'm glad that's your

1457
01:14:57,590 --> 01:14:56,580
perspective on it because that's what I

1458
01:14:59,810 --> 01:14:57,600
found is

1459
01:15:01,729 --> 01:14:59,820
when P you first start learning how to

1460
01:15:03,530 --> 01:15:01,739
do it it is very much just what you're

1461
01:15:07,010 --> 01:15:03,540
hearing and then you almost go into the

1462
01:15:08,810 --> 01:15:07,020
state where it's almost intuitive

1463
01:15:10,669 --> 01:15:08,820
um and you're at least for me getting

1464
01:15:12,050 --> 01:15:10,679
Impressions

1465
01:15:13,430 --> 01:15:12,060
um and I know that other folks I mean

1466
01:15:15,410 --> 01:15:13,440
other folks are spontaneously remote

1467
01:15:17,689 --> 01:15:15,420
viewed while doing it which I think is

1468
01:15:22,490 --> 01:15:17,699
fascinating so do you think a lot of

1469
01:15:28,790 --> 01:15:25,610
I think that

1470
01:15:31,130 --> 01:15:28,800
the Estes method is a good tool for

1471
01:15:34,669 --> 01:15:31,140
getting to that place in Consciousness

1472
01:15:35,990 --> 01:15:34,679
especially for people who have been

1473
01:15:40,250 --> 01:15:36,000
uh

1474
01:15:42,950 --> 01:15:40,260
raised on electronic media

1475
01:15:45,770 --> 01:15:42,960
in other words virtually everyone living

1476
01:15:48,649 --> 01:15:45,780
now you know so

1477
01:15:51,590 --> 01:15:48,659
unless they're somewhere in the

1478
01:15:56,770 --> 01:15:51,600
way back of Borneo you know and even

1479
01:16:00,070 --> 01:15:56,780
there who knows I mean I've seen uh

1480
01:16:05,649 --> 01:16:00,080
documentaries about the uh quote

1481
01:16:09,590 --> 01:16:05,659
primitive people in the upper Amazon

1482
01:16:11,450 --> 01:16:09,600
where the chief goes into his Hut with

1483
01:16:16,310 --> 01:16:11,460
his you know little loincloths and

1484
01:16:20,350 --> 01:16:16,320
things and turns on his transceiver to

1485
01:16:23,870 --> 01:16:20,360
talk to people on the outside about

1486
01:16:26,630 --> 01:16:23,880
the encroachment by people who are

1487
01:16:29,390 --> 01:16:26,640
tearing down the Amazon forest and

1488
01:16:32,590 --> 01:16:29,400
choking the rest of us all to death so

1489
01:16:35,090 --> 01:16:32,600
there there's you know a technology

1490
01:16:41,270 --> 01:16:35,100
everywhere and

1491
01:16:43,729 --> 01:16:41,280
raised in a technological Society like

1492
01:16:46,910 --> 01:16:43,739
it hate it or otherwise you're going to

1493
01:16:48,430 --> 01:16:46,920
be responsible responsive to

1494
01:16:52,970 --> 01:16:48,440
technological

1495
01:16:55,790 --> 01:16:52,980
assistance for paranormal States not

1496
01:16:58,610 --> 01:16:55,800
necessarily because there are gifted

1497
01:17:02,870 --> 01:16:58,620
people that don't need any of that but

1498
01:17:03,790 --> 01:17:02,880
if you are just plain Joe or Alan you

1499
01:17:06,950 --> 01:17:03,800
know

1500
01:17:08,149 --> 01:17:06,960
you probably can use that assistance I

1501
01:17:10,070 --> 01:17:08,159
mean

1502
01:17:12,590 --> 01:17:10,080
well let's see

1503
01:17:15,770 --> 01:17:12,600
I have a brainwave synchronizer right

1504
01:17:20,330 --> 01:17:15,780
here you know so I believe this stuff

1505
01:17:23,450 --> 01:17:20,340
helps enhance you but I also think that

1506
01:17:25,669 --> 01:17:23,460
with passengers

1507
01:17:29,390 --> 01:17:25,679
excessively materialist point of view

1508
01:17:31,090 --> 01:17:29,400
nevertheless he is correct that uh the

1509
01:17:32,990 --> 01:17:31,100
uh

1510
01:17:36,770 --> 01:17:33,000
electromagnetic field of the earth

1511
01:17:39,530 --> 01:17:36,780
affects Visionary experiences to which I

1512
01:17:42,590 --> 01:17:39,540
would add the very very temperamental

1513
01:17:44,229 --> 01:17:42,600
behavior of the sun right now throwing

1514
01:17:46,669 --> 01:17:44,239
uh

1515
01:17:51,169 --> 01:17:46,679
electromagnetic effects at us all the

1516
01:17:53,689 --> 01:17:51,179
time is causing very interesting effects

1517
01:17:56,330 --> 01:17:53,699
in the population in general and of

1518
01:17:58,910 --> 01:17:56,340
course I don't know of anyone who is

1519
01:18:01,810 --> 01:17:58,920
collecting that now if you if you work

1520
01:18:04,850 --> 01:18:01,820
with the person you're a God helmet

1521
01:18:07,970 --> 01:18:04,860
uh there is a device in the computer

1522
01:18:10,729 --> 01:18:07,980
programming for it that lets you know

1523
01:18:13,850 --> 01:18:10,739
what's going on with the uh

1524
01:18:19,070 --> 01:18:13,860
the invisible em effects that are going

1525
01:18:21,350 --> 01:18:19,080
on in the earth's vicinity it's like

1526
01:18:23,270 --> 01:18:21,360
best be aware of that before you even

1527
01:18:27,110 --> 01:18:23,280
put the helmet on because you might be

1528
01:18:29,630 --> 01:18:27,120
getting natural effects but um

1529
01:18:32,810 --> 01:18:29,640
passenger thinks well that explains it

1530
01:18:36,229 --> 01:18:32,820
it's all in the brain the brain is the

1531
01:18:39,890 --> 01:18:36,239
thing but I think that it's

1532
01:18:44,270 --> 01:18:39,900
I think mostly the anatomy of the human

1533
01:18:45,530 --> 01:18:44,280
brain is a focusing and a damping

1534
01:18:48,169 --> 01:18:45,540
mechanism

1535
01:18:51,950 --> 01:18:48,179
it's not the source of anything you

1536
01:18:52,990 --> 01:18:51,960
examine the brain as is The Fad in in

1537
01:18:56,590 --> 01:18:53,000
science

1538
01:18:59,169 --> 01:18:56,600
since Penfield in the 70s and mostly

1539
01:19:03,350 --> 01:18:59,179
since uh

1540
01:19:06,470 --> 01:19:03,360
magnetic resonance oh this lights up

1541
01:19:10,430 --> 01:19:06,480
when you think about gold therefore this

1542
01:19:12,709 --> 01:19:10,440
produces gold well you know that's it's

1543
01:19:17,149 --> 01:19:12,719
measuring Heat

1544
01:19:18,830 --> 01:19:17,159
flow of blood to that area but if you

1545
01:19:21,709 --> 01:19:18,840
measured your shoulder when you're doing

1546
01:19:24,290 --> 01:19:21,719
exercises it would generate more heat

1547
01:19:28,490 --> 01:19:24,300
too so as your shoulders doing your

1548
01:19:29,270 --> 01:19:28,500
thinking for you but I think therefore I

1549
01:19:34,250 --> 01:19:29,280
am

1550
01:19:36,290 --> 01:19:34,260
hello I'm Alan's hat I mean much of what

1551
01:19:37,669 --> 01:19:36,300
and that brings me to the one point I

1552
01:19:40,910 --> 01:19:37,679
wanted to get in

1553
01:19:42,890 --> 01:19:40,920
somewhere on your program

1554
01:19:44,689 --> 01:19:42,900
about disclosure

1555
01:19:47,930 --> 01:19:44,699
now this is where they're all going to

1556
01:19:50,630 --> 01:19:47,940
switch off that that don't have an

1557
01:19:54,709 --> 01:19:50,640
Explorer's mentality

1558
01:19:56,470 --> 01:19:54,719
to to have government disclosure of the

1559
01:20:00,290 --> 01:19:56,480
truth about

1560
01:20:01,910 --> 01:20:00,300
UFO's paranormal phenomena any of that

1561
01:20:03,130 --> 01:20:01,920
that they may or may not have

1562
01:20:05,930 --> 01:20:03,140
investigated

1563
01:20:10,189 --> 01:20:05,940
you have to have something to disclose

1564
01:20:13,669 --> 01:20:10,199
yes I mean I think there are things that

1565
01:20:16,070 --> 01:20:13,679
are secret but they mostly involve or

1566
01:20:18,709 --> 01:20:16,080
entirely involve weapon systems that

1567
01:20:19,669 --> 01:20:18,719
have yet to make their way onto the

1568
01:20:23,570 --> 01:20:19,679
market

1569
01:20:27,070 --> 01:20:23,580
so to speak and in these troubled times

1570
01:20:29,450 --> 01:20:27,080
ask any Ukrainian about that

1571
01:20:31,610 --> 01:20:29,460
don't ask any Russian about that they'll

1572
01:20:34,669 --> 01:20:31,620
say what troubled times it's

1573
01:20:37,689 --> 01:20:34,679
I'm I'm going to Saks Fifth Avenue only

1574
01:20:42,770 --> 01:20:40,310
because it's the local version sax

1575
01:20:43,790 --> 01:20:42,780
having gone back to New York

1576
01:20:46,610 --> 01:20:43,800
um

1577
01:20:47,630 --> 01:20:46,620
it is a good thing that those things are

1578
01:20:49,810 --> 01:20:47,640
secret

1579
01:20:53,630 --> 01:20:49,820
and developmental

1580
01:20:57,430 --> 01:20:53,640
and therefore I think that a chasing

1581
01:21:04,430 --> 01:21:01,430
agencies that are built on and Dedicated

1582
01:21:06,590 --> 01:21:04,440
To Nuts and Bolts

1583
01:21:09,830 --> 01:21:06,600
is never going to find any more than

1584
01:21:14,470 --> 01:21:09,840
private ufologists have who are nuts and

1585
01:21:19,910 --> 01:21:16,250
factoids

1586
01:21:21,530 --> 01:21:19,920
but no conclusions what I would suggest

1587
01:21:24,610 --> 01:21:21,540
is

1588
01:21:29,810 --> 01:21:27,649
the integration of these various

1589
01:21:33,430 --> 01:21:29,820
elements and some others that we haven't

1590
01:21:37,870 --> 01:21:33,440
discussed of paranormal phenomena

1591
01:21:45,910 --> 01:21:41,930
Estes method other methods including

1592
01:21:52,130 --> 01:21:45,920
those that Wilhelm like put forward

1593
01:21:58,970 --> 01:21:56,510
different types of beings that are being

1594
01:22:03,110 --> 01:21:58,980
seen and

1595
01:22:05,709 --> 01:22:03,120
because UFO organizations have a pinch

1596
01:22:07,310 --> 01:22:05,719
on for

1597
01:22:10,669 --> 01:22:07,320
lists

1598
01:22:12,110 --> 01:22:10,679
they will ask a witness was it bigger

1599
01:22:13,729 --> 01:22:12,120
than a donut

1600
01:22:16,910 --> 01:22:13,739
you know

1601
01:22:18,550 --> 01:22:16,920
held at Arms links that used to be a

1602
01:22:22,189 --> 01:22:18,560
standard question

1603
01:22:25,310 --> 01:22:22,199
you ask a silly question you get a silly

1604
01:22:28,669 --> 01:22:25,320
answer it's an old cliche but it is very

1605
01:22:31,729 --> 01:22:28,679
true so if you're asking the same

1606
01:22:33,770 --> 01:22:31,739
questions they were asking in

1607
01:22:36,830 --> 01:22:33,780
the international Flying Saucer Bureau

1608
01:22:39,669 --> 01:22:36,840
in 1953 you're going to get the same

1609
01:22:43,189 --> 01:22:39,679
answer which is

1610
01:22:46,310 --> 01:22:43,199
this guy appears to have seen something

1611
01:22:48,470 --> 01:22:46,320
this woman appears to have experienced

1612
01:22:51,649 --> 01:22:48,480
something and that's as far as it goes

1613
01:22:56,990 --> 01:22:51,659
you're not able to go beyond that

1614
01:22:59,450 --> 01:22:57,000
but available but not integrated

1615
01:23:02,209 --> 01:22:59,460
are the other phenomena that have the

1616
01:23:04,669 --> 01:23:02,219
same characteristics and that's the

1617
01:23:07,610 --> 01:23:04,679
first thing that one should do the

1618
01:23:08,810 --> 01:23:07,620
second thing is in my opinion and this

1619
01:23:12,729 --> 01:23:08,820
is something

1620
01:23:18,290 --> 01:23:12,739
20 years ago I would not have emphasized

1621
01:23:21,830 --> 01:23:18,300
you need to integrate the findings

1622
01:23:24,470 --> 01:23:21,840
and projecting into the future the

1623
01:23:28,729 --> 01:23:24,480
findings of quantum mechanics right

1624
01:23:32,390 --> 01:23:28,739
because with quantum mechanics comes

1625
01:23:36,530 --> 01:23:32,400
not necessarily the correct Theory

1626
01:23:39,590 --> 01:23:36,540
as of now but projecting outward you

1627
01:23:42,470 --> 01:23:39,600
have the many worlds interpretation you

1628
01:23:43,870 --> 01:23:42,480
have the interesting stuff that's coming

1629
01:23:49,430 --> 01:23:43,880
from people like

1630
01:23:54,649 --> 01:23:51,130
other August

1631
01:23:56,870 --> 01:23:54,659
physicists and now just beginning I ran

1632
01:23:59,450 --> 01:23:56,880
something today on my Twitter feed I'm

1633
01:24:02,450 --> 01:23:59,460
on Twitter every day giving the truth

1634
01:24:03,770 --> 01:24:02,460
the light but not the way the way is up

1635
01:24:04,970 --> 01:24:03,780
to you

1636
01:24:07,310 --> 01:24:04,980
um

1637
01:24:09,649 --> 01:24:07,320
whatever that means

1638
01:24:16,130 --> 01:24:13,490
the notion that the universe is sort of

1639
01:24:18,470 --> 01:24:16,140
the nietzschean thing that

1640
01:24:20,990 --> 01:24:18,480
you have eternal returns there's a

1641
01:24:23,390 --> 01:24:21,000
universe it expands

1642
01:24:26,770 --> 01:24:23,400
develops a sufficient entropy it

1643
01:24:29,870 --> 01:24:26,780
collapses and then expands again

1644
01:24:32,030 --> 01:24:29,880
endlessly whatever a term like endlessly

1645
01:24:35,630 --> 01:24:32,040
would mean in a universe where there's

1646
01:24:37,930 --> 01:24:35,640
no space and there's no time those are

1647
01:24:39,890 --> 01:24:37,940
only constructs

1648
01:24:43,790 --> 01:24:39,900
after

1649
01:24:46,010 --> 01:24:43,800
the Big Bang or Big Bangs or you know

1650
01:24:47,689 --> 01:24:46,020
when I was a kid big bang was not the

1651
01:24:50,030 --> 01:24:47,699
accepted Theory

1652
01:24:52,010 --> 01:24:50,040
you know dinosaurs were the accepted

1653
01:24:54,649 --> 01:24:52,020
Theory don't let them eat your kid if

1654
01:24:56,330 --> 01:24:54,659
you go in the yard and it's a T-Rex get

1655
01:24:58,490 --> 01:24:56,340
back in the house and tell them to eat

1656
01:25:00,830 --> 01:24:58,500
another dinosaur

1657
01:25:03,830 --> 01:25:00,840
that was the principle the uh the

1658
01:25:07,010 --> 01:25:03,840
counselor said oh they won't hurt you

1659
01:25:08,390 --> 01:25:07,020
he was later eaten unfortunately good

1660
01:25:10,790 --> 01:25:08,400
guy

1661
01:25:11,709 --> 01:25:10,800
eaten by a Tyrannosaurus Rex what a

1662
01:25:16,130 --> 01:25:11,719
shame

1663
01:25:18,709 --> 01:25:16,140
yeah no he was eaten by a Stegosaurus a

1664
01:25:25,930 --> 01:25:18,719
purely vegetarian thing who regarded him

1665
01:25:33,410 --> 01:25:30,410
so that is my main rant these days

1666
01:25:35,930 --> 01:25:33,420
if you integrate the various phenomena

1667
01:25:37,250 --> 01:25:35,940
and say they have such similar

1668
01:25:39,950 --> 01:25:37,260
characteristics they're probably

1669
01:25:41,110 --> 01:25:39,960
different heads of the same Hydra so to

1670
01:25:43,010 --> 01:25:41,120
speak

1671
01:25:46,250 --> 01:25:43,020
and then

1672
01:25:48,169 --> 01:25:46,260
integrate that with the most Cutting

1673
01:25:50,169 --> 01:25:48,179
Edge physics which I think may

1674
01:25:52,669 --> 01:25:50,179
eventually overthrow physics altogether

1675
01:25:54,770 --> 01:25:52,679
and I'm certainly not the first person

1676
01:25:58,250 --> 01:25:54,780
to say that

1677
01:26:01,070 --> 01:25:58,260
um May overthrow the notion of

1678
01:26:04,310 --> 01:26:01,080
scientific explanations for reality

1679
01:26:07,930 --> 01:26:04,320
period we may be dealing with something

1680
01:26:13,129 --> 01:26:07,940
better understood in terms of

1681
01:26:19,129 --> 01:26:16,970
and Mythos in the Joseph Campbell sense

1682
01:26:22,610 --> 01:26:19,139
then we're dealing with something that

1683
01:26:25,070 --> 01:26:22,620
has a rigid scientific explanation that

1684
01:26:27,970 --> 01:26:25,080
I can't know at this point but I would

1685
01:26:32,090 --> 01:26:27,980
suggest if the Next Generation

1686
01:26:35,450 --> 01:26:32,100
integrates these things they will

1687
01:26:37,729 --> 01:26:35,460
be able to follow the synchronicities to

1688
01:26:39,290 --> 01:26:37,739
a much better perspective on all this

1689
01:26:40,930 --> 01:26:39,300
stuff

1690
01:26:42,910 --> 01:26:40,940
oh

1691
01:26:46,790 --> 01:26:42,920
man

1692
01:26:51,770 --> 01:26:49,490
wrap this up on I don't know what

1693
01:26:55,310 --> 01:26:51,780
she's there shutting me up now they're

1694
01:26:59,450 --> 01:26:57,110
I'm just worried about Vinnie I think

1695
01:27:01,669 --> 01:26:59,460
he's looking at what 2 30 a.m for you

1696
01:27:04,390 --> 01:27:01,679
bud it is it is yeah I have to be up in

1697
01:27:08,390 --> 01:27:04,400
a few hours at my door as well

1698
01:27:12,229 --> 01:27:08,400
oh well ask me didn't any of your your

1699
01:27:15,590 --> 01:27:12,239
Watchers ask any questions they did we

1700
01:27:18,530 --> 01:27:15,600
had one other question Carolina Garcia

1701
01:27:20,629 --> 01:27:18,540
are there any new theories or areas of

1702
01:27:22,970 --> 01:27:20,639
research that you find particularly

1703
01:27:24,709 --> 01:27:22,980
intriguing or promising

1704
01:27:27,290 --> 01:27:24,719
I think I just answered that question

1705
01:27:30,169 --> 01:27:27,300
yeah I don't I don't know that it's

1706
01:27:32,689 --> 01:27:30,179
exactly new but it's new to

1707
01:27:35,629 --> 01:27:32,699
Enigma research

1708
01:27:37,490 --> 01:27:35,639
I don't call myself a ufologist I have

1709
01:27:38,689 --> 01:27:37,500
for many years called myself a Para

1710
01:27:41,689 --> 01:27:38,699
ufologist

1711
01:27:43,550 --> 01:27:41,699
and I would love if that term had more

1712
01:27:47,390 --> 01:27:43,560
uh

1713
01:27:50,270 --> 01:27:47,400
agency that it now does because I think

1714
01:27:52,189 --> 01:27:50,280
that what we're doing if we want to

1715
01:27:54,350 --> 01:27:52,199
really understand this stuff is that

1716
01:27:56,450 --> 01:27:54,360
it's Perry ufology is your shoulder

1717
01:27:58,850 --> 01:27:56,460
still bothering you

1718
01:28:03,410 --> 01:27:58,860
then he let me do a healing on you right

1719
01:28:05,510 --> 01:28:03,420
now okay you want to heal it why not is

1720
01:28:23,990 --> 01:28:05,520
your shoulder still bothering you it's

1721
01:28:29,870 --> 01:28:26,750
it's the most distant healing that I've

1722
01:28:32,030 --> 01:28:29,880
ever done but I do do distant stuff that

1723
01:28:34,370 --> 01:28:32,040
works pretty well

1724
01:28:35,810 --> 01:28:34,380
um and I wanted to say one other thing

1725
01:28:37,729 --> 01:28:35,820
about

1726
01:28:39,970 --> 01:28:37,739
do I get to do a plug at the end of this

1727
01:28:43,550 --> 01:28:39,980
of course okay

1728
01:28:47,629 --> 01:28:43,560
but this is not the plug this is just

1729
01:28:51,470 --> 01:28:47,639
during The Long Dark period when it was

1730
01:28:53,030 --> 01:28:51,480
just belay famous and Allen who the hell

1731
01:28:54,010 --> 01:28:53,040
is he

1732
01:28:57,950 --> 01:28:54,020
um

1733
01:29:00,610 --> 01:28:57,960
shouting in the wilderness as it were

1734
01:29:04,669 --> 01:29:00,620
on this side of the pond

1735
01:29:08,390 --> 01:29:04,679
I was treated as the odd step child Walt

1736
01:29:11,030 --> 01:29:08,400
Andrus once jumped on B4 one year I had

1737
01:29:13,610 --> 01:29:11,040
on a suit because that was in those days

1738
01:29:15,890 --> 01:29:13,620
I owned a suit and the next year at the

1739
01:29:20,270 --> 01:29:15,900
mufon Gathering

1740
01:29:23,450 --> 01:29:20,280
I had on my full hippie regalia now

1741
01:29:26,810 --> 01:29:23,460
bottoms my hair down well out to here

1742
01:29:29,030 --> 01:29:26,820
because if if Jewish people try to grow

1743
01:29:32,330 --> 01:29:29,040
their hair down like Jimmy Page or

1744
01:29:35,149 --> 01:29:32,340
something it goes out so I call it a Jew

1745
01:29:37,910 --> 01:29:35,159
fro you know so so there I was that you

1746
01:29:39,169 --> 01:29:37,920
throwing beads and stuff and Walt looks

1747
01:29:41,450 --> 01:29:39,179
at me and he said

1748
01:29:43,550 --> 01:29:41,460
it used to be a clean-cut guy what

1749
01:29:47,450 --> 01:29:43,560
happened to you

1750
01:29:53,330 --> 01:29:47,460
and I smiled and said out of Vietnam now

1751
01:29:59,930 --> 01:29:56,930
um at that same period which was a long

1752
01:30:02,810 --> 01:29:59,940
long period of decades

1753
01:30:06,830 --> 01:30:05,149
I have to be careful here the British

1754
01:30:08,689 --> 01:30:06,840
ufologists particularly English

1755
01:30:11,810 --> 01:30:08,699
ufologists

1756
01:30:14,870 --> 01:30:11,820
were always more sympathetic and open to

1757
01:30:17,390 --> 01:30:14,880
my ideas and we're glad to publish them

1758
01:30:20,629 --> 01:30:17,400
and commented on them favorably that

1759
01:30:22,870 --> 01:30:20,639
would be uh the the big hitters of that

1760
01:30:28,129 --> 01:30:22,880
period Flying Saucer review

1761
01:30:30,410 --> 01:30:28,139
uh and uh Gordon Creighton and I were

1762
01:30:35,050 --> 01:30:30,420
pretty tight

1763
01:30:38,510 --> 01:30:35,060
um brinsley trench invited me to dinner

1764
01:30:40,070 --> 01:30:38,520
later Lord trench

1765
01:30:43,850 --> 01:30:40,080
um

1766
01:30:45,530 --> 01:30:43,860
what was at first the mercy side UFO

1767
01:30:48,410 --> 01:30:45,540
Bulletin

1768
01:30:51,530 --> 01:30:48,420
which later became begonia

1769
01:30:54,350 --> 01:30:51,540
after presumably a passport was

1770
01:30:58,010 --> 01:30:54,360
published the most literate magazine

1771
01:31:01,610 --> 01:30:58,020
ever in ufology anywhere in the world

1772
01:31:04,669 --> 01:31:01,620
uh was very sympathetic to me as was the

1773
01:31:06,890 --> 01:31:04,679
British UFO research Association before

1774
01:31:08,689 --> 01:31:06,900
and those were the Heavy Hitters of

1775
01:31:13,070 --> 01:31:08,699
those times

1776
01:31:15,770 --> 01:31:13,080
and I have eternally been appreciative

1777
01:31:18,470 --> 01:31:15,780
of that because it meant that I wasn't

1778
01:31:21,770 --> 01:31:18,480
just in the wilderness I was simply in

1779
01:31:26,030 --> 01:31:24,890
which is sometimes slow to pick up on

1780
01:31:29,870 --> 01:31:26,040
uh

1781
01:31:34,490 --> 01:31:29,880
radically new ideas and the same is true

1782
01:31:37,669 --> 01:31:34,500
now I I get more offers to speak

1783
01:31:40,970 --> 01:31:37,679
from Mostly from northern England for

1784
01:31:43,669 --> 01:31:40,980
some reason but uh and from the Scots

1785
01:31:47,270 --> 01:31:43,679
you know I'm all

1786
01:31:49,149 --> 01:31:47,280
for the Scottish people

1787
01:31:52,550 --> 01:31:49,159
um

1788
01:31:55,790 --> 01:31:52,560
that's been very important for me and

1789
01:31:59,149 --> 01:31:55,800
has continued to be although now you

1790
01:32:04,850 --> 01:32:01,910
people who grew up

1791
01:32:08,590 --> 01:32:04,860
integrating the occult

1792
01:32:10,189 --> 01:32:08,600
so-called with ufology

1793
01:32:17,110 --> 01:32:10,199
and

1794
01:32:23,629 --> 01:32:19,830
oh beautiful

1795
01:32:28,310 --> 01:32:25,850
yeah before we finish that one please

1796
01:32:29,510 --> 01:32:28,320
plug whatever you want to plug

1797
01:32:32,570 --> 01:32:29,520
okay

1798
01:32:43,209 --> 01:32:36,229
hold on let me take a little of my Irish

1799
01:32:47,870 --> 01:32:45,470
no no

1800
01:32:49,189 --> 01:32:47,880
by the rising of no I better not do that

1801
01:32:53,510 --> 01:32:49,199
when I'm talking about my British

1802
01:33:01,510 --> 01:32:57,970
um I didn't say that I didn't say that

1803
01:33:05,990 --> 01:33:03,890
Scottish independence

1804
01:33:08,689 --> 01:33:06,000
Wales I don't know they can't understand

1805
01:33:12,470 --> 01:33:08,699
what I say and I certainly don't

1806
01:33:14,930 --> 01:33:12,480
understand what they say no too many L's

1807
01:33:18,590 --> 01:33:14,940
too many else and other words and

1808
01:33:23,629 --> 01:33:18,600
Llewellyn once rejected a book of mine

1809
01:33:28,250 --> 01:33:25,310
um

1810
01:33:29,990 --> 01:33:28,260
don't hesitate to buy the complete

1811
01:33:32,090 --> 01:33:30,000
Secret side for the euphenots even

1812
01:33:34,310 --> 01:33:32,100
though I said when the new book comes

1813
01:33:36,709 --> 01:33:34,320
out it won't be complete because one of

1814
01:33:41,990 --> 01:33:36,719
two things well yes

1815
01:33:47,810 --> 01:33:42,000
oh it reflects and those are Mo Larry

1816
01:33:55,669 --> 01:33:51,970
um I don't do the covers I used to like

1817
01:33:57,649 --> 01:33:55,679
covers and have great title ideas and

1818
01:33:58,850 --> 01:33:57,659
they almost get batted down by my

1819
01:34:00,709 --> 01:33:58,860
publishers

1820
01:34:04,370 --> 01:34:00,719
but

1821
01:34:06,229 --> 01:34:04,380
I I my understanding is when it comes

1822
01:34:08,270 --> 01:34:06,239
out which will be soon

1823
01:34:12,169 --> 01:34:08,280
I'm not going to put a date on it

1824
01:34:14,950 --> 01:34:12,179
because I don't know but soon the the

1825
01:34:18,830 --> 01:34:14,960
real Black Lodge

1826
01:34:21,050 --> 01:34:18,840
revealed or exposed

1827
01:34:25,430 --> 01:34:21,060
um will definitely be

1828
01:34:27,950 --> 01:34:25,440
the long-awaited third volume and will

1829
01:34:31,250 --> 01:34:27,960
be a standalone book available from all

1830
01:34:32,709 --> 01:34:31,260
the usual sellers you get it from Amazon

1831
01:34:35,450 --> 01:34:32,719
UK

1832
01:34:37,729 --> 01:34:35,460
Used to Be The Book Depository but I

1833
01:34:41,390 --> 01:34:37,739
hear Amazon bought them and are putting

1834
01:34:43,570 --> 01:34:41,400
them out of business I mean after this

1835
01:34:46,970 --> 01:34:43,580
month actually that they're

1836
01:34:47,590 --> 01:34:46,980
ceasing to be

1837
01:34:50,270 --> 01:34:47,600
um

1838
01:34:54,470 --> 01:34:50,280
and then there's uh

1839
01:34:56,530 --> 01:34:54,480
Barnes and Noble and virtually any of

1840
01:35:02,270 --> 01:34:56,540
the major

1841
01:35:02,280 --> 01:35:06,050
sorry uh

1842
01:35:13,189 --> 01:35:09,290
and uh so it will be a freestanding book

1843
01:35:14,750 --> 01:35:13,199
but if my publisher follows my advice

1844
01:35:16,729 --> 01:35:14,760
eventually

1845
01:35:19,189 --> 01:35:16,739
it will be

1846
01:35:20,810 --> 01:35:19,199
have an edition of complete secret

1847
01:35:25,189 --> 01:35:20,820
Cipher

1848
01:35:26,810 --> 01:35:25,199
which will contain all three so now they

1849
01:35:29,990 --> 01:35:26,820
may not follow my advice you know

1850
01:35:32,450 --> 01:35:30,000
there's not a necessity of that and I

1851
01:35:35,450 --> 01:35:32,460
just write on my own you know have

1852
01:35:39,110 --> 01:35:35,460
authority over them but uh

1853
01:35:42,770 --> 01:35:39,120
but I would like that to be the case and

1854
01:35:46,550 --> 01:35:42,780
hopefully it will so you can

1855
01:35:48,770 --> 01:35:46,560
if you you buy the current version it

1856
01:35:50,570 --> 01:35:48,780
will become a rare volume someday if

1857
01:35:53,689 --> 01:35:50,580
they if the third one happens and if not

1858
01:35:56,810 --> 01:35:53,699
you've got those two and if you get the

1859
01:35:58,550 --> 01:35:56,820
three the third volume

1860
01:36:01,430 --> 01:35:58,560
um

1861
01:36:04,070 --> 01:36:01,440
as a freestanding thing then you can put

1862
01:36:05,750 --> 01:36:04,080
it next to the complete secret Cipher on

1863
01:36:09,050 --> 01:36:05,760
your bookshelf and be proud about it

1864
01:36:11,709 --> 01:36:09,060
other books if you're interested in

1865
01:36:14,870 --> 01:36:11,719
sexual Magic

1866
01:36:16,550 --> 01:36:14,880
from a point of view that you don't get

1867
01:36:19,370 --> 01:36:16,560
anywhere else

1868
01:36:20,090 --> 01:36:19,380
in public anyway

1869
01:36:23,570 --> 01:36:20,100
um

1870
01:36:26,990 --> 01:36:23,580
uh the Grail within is my book on that

1871
01:36:29,689 --> 01:36:27,000
subject that was originally printed but

1872
01:36:32,930 --> 01:36:29,699
not published only for initiates and is

1873
01:36:35,330 --> 01:36:32,940
now available to a greater public that

1874
01:36:36,129 --> 01:36:35,340
is people who are really interested in

1875
01:36:40,370 --> 01:36:36,139
that

1876
01:36:42,350 --> 01:36:40,380
and what else do I have saucers and

1877
01:36:45,530 --> 01:36:42,360
saucers if you want to know about the

1878
01:36:47,450 --> 01:36:45,540
good old days in ufology

1879
01:36:50,570 --> 01:36:47,460
uh why not

1880
01:36:54,830 --> 01:36:50,580
well there's a photo in it of the first

1881
01:36:57,410 --> 01:36:54,840
uh National UFO conference in 1964 which

1882
01:36:59,930 --> 01:36:57,420
I took and all of The Luminaries of that

1883
01:37:01,370 --> 01:36:59,940
period are in it it's a good photo I've

1884
01:37:06,350 --> 01:37:01,380
kept it all these years I think it was

1885
01:37:08,390 --> 01:37:06,360
originally a Polaroid and one of my uh

1886
01:37:10,490 --> 01:37:08,400
devotees on

1887
01:37:12,350 --> 01:37:10,500
Twitter said

1888
01:37:15,169 --> 01:37:12,360
how come there no women in the picture

1889
01:37:18,350 --> 01:37:15,179
and I was thinking the question I ask

1890
01:37:22,310 --> 01:37:18,360
now of UFO conferences well that that's

1891
01:37:25,370 --> 01:37:22,320
my point there is a dearth of women in

1892
01:37:28,629 --> 01:37:25,380
most of these fields and there are a

1893
01:37:31,490 --> 01:37:28,639
variety of reasons for that but being

1894
01:37:33,290 --> 01:37:31,500
exclusionistic is one of those reasons

1895
01:37:35,750 --> 01:37:33,300
and

1896
01:37:39,590 --> 01:37:35,760
I don't know I did a stint as a lodge

1897
01:37:45,110 --> 01:37:39,600
master and we had people of every stripe

1898
01:37:47,629 --> 01:37:45,120
in you and point of view and that ceased

1899
01:37:51,290 --> 01:37:47,639
after I I was the launch master

1900
01:37:55,729 --> 01:37:51,300
it's the right thing to be it's also the

1901
01:37:58,970 --> 01:37:55,739
richest way to be able to get ideas from

1902
01:38:01,490 --> 01:37:58,980
everywhere yeah except we didn't allow

1903
01:38:07,570 --> 01:38:01,500
Nazis we beat them up in the behind the

1904
01:38:12,169 --> 01:38:10,370
yeah well you know I'm

1905
01:38:14,410 --> 01:38:12,179
I have a

1906
01:38:16,910 --> 01:38:14,420
a dog in that hunt

1907
01:38:18,950 --> 01:38:16,920
well listen Alan I have popped in the

1908
01:38:20,750 --> 01:38:18,960
description of this video links to where

1909
01:38:22,129 --> 01:38:20,760
people can go and buy your books and

1910
01:38:24,770 --> 01:38:22,139
also to where they can follow you on

1911
01:38:25,610 --> 01:38:24,780
Twitter so any information about the the

1912
01:38:28,310 --> 01:38:25,620
Third

1913
01:38:30,649 --> 01:38:28,320
uh book when it comes out people can can

1914
01:38:32,270 --> 01:38:30,659
get the the information on it but I just

1915
01:38:34,310 --> 01:38:32,280
want to say a massive thank you to to

1916
01:38:37,010 --> 01:38:34,320
you to Katie and to everyone watching

1917
01:38:39,010 --> 01:38:37,020
it's been a really fun conversation and

1918
01:38:41,990 --> 01:38:39,020
I really do appreciate it so thank you

1919
01:38:44,990 --> 01:38:42,000
oh it's been delightful how long have we

1920
01:38:46,930 --> 01:38:45,000
been doing this uh as they've all gone

1921
01:38:54,470 --> 01:38:46,940
to sleep

1922
01:38:59,030 --> 01:38:56,990
that's monkeying so so much Alan it's

1923
01:39:02,330 --> 01:38:59,040
been a pleasure just to kind of

1924
01:39:05,510 --> 01:39:02,340
integrate some new ideas into our

1925
01:39:08,390 --> 01:39:05,520
disclosure uh community and we

1926
01:39:10,729 --> 01:39:08,400
appreciate that uh

1927
01:39:13,189 --> 01:39:10,739
the education you've given us a bit

1928
01:39:15,590 --> 01:39:13,199
today you know and we hope to hear more

1929
01:39:16,729 --> 01:39:15,600
from you and I can't wait to read your

1930
01:39:19,729 --> 01:39:16,739
new book

1931
01:39:22,370 --> 01:39:19,739
absolutely hey that's great endorsement

1932
01:39:24,709 --> 01:39:22,380
there don't forget Katie said I didn't

1933
01:39:26,870 --> 01:39:24,719
say that and I didn't prompt your checks

1934
01:39:29,870 --> 01:39:26,880
in the mail I didn't want her to say

1935
01:39:31,430 --> 01:39:29,880
that you're welcome plus an extra 10

1936
01:39:32,930 --> 01:39:31,440
percent

1937
01:39:34,970 --> 01:39:32,940
okay

1938
01:39:37,790 --> 01:39:34,980
so yeah guys thank you so much for

1939
01:39:41,030 --> 01:39:37,800
watching please follow subscribe like

1940
01:39:43,610 --> 01:39:41,040
and go and follow and Alan and by his

1941
01:39:45,410 --> 01:39:43,620
books but until next time guys we'll see